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 Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"

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mouser9169
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:10 pm

I wanted to try Skyrim, but I refuse to give money to a company that forces you to use a 'rental' DRM system for your game (and especially without even letting you know on the box before you open it).

If they ever remove the Steam installation and activation, I'd give it a go. Just picked up a copy of The Witcher 2 (no DRM at all now, thank you very much).

I like my games with no evil (on the outside, evil inside the game is fine Twisted Evil )
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:23 pm

Aww, lighten up. I hate Steam just as much as the next guy, but Skyrim is totally worth it. Unless you know of any ways around Steam, which I don't, so...
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ThePhilosopher
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:45 pm

Voraxith! That video you made was awesome! Got me smiling ear to ear all the way through! sunny

Where did those NPCs learned to dance like that? lol
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PGM1961
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:02 pm

Voraxith wrote:
Aww, lighten up. I hate Steam just as much as the next guy, but Skyrim is totally worth it. Unless you know of any ways around Steam, which I don't, so...

Do you have to play Skyrim through Steam, or is it just for installation and activation? I hate any game that forces you to play through their servers, and save your games on their system. My internet goes out sometimes, and I hate not being able to play the games when that happens. If it's an MMO, that's different; but I should be able to play an FPS on just my computer, dammit.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:09 pm

Your saves are kept in your My Documents folder, but you have to launch Skyrim through Steam, but I don't think it requires you to be online -- just have Steam running. Yeah, I hate it, too. Hopefully Beth fixes that at some point in the future. I think they did with Fallout, didn't they?
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mouser9169
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:37 pm

Voraxith wrote:
Aww, lighten up. I hate Steam just as much as the next guy, but Skyrim is totally worth it. Unless you know of any ways around Steam, which I don't, so...

It's not just a Steam thing, it's the deception involved.

That's not the sort of thing that should be completely left out of every product description and not listed anywhere on the retail box.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:24 pm

I'm 100% against DRMs period, except for a basic disc check before playing, that doesn't bother me. But servers, Steam, etc... I hate it all.

The reason these companies do it is to stop game pirating, yet people still find ways around it so all they are really doing is pissing off the consumer.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:14 pm

PGM1961 wrote:

Do you have to play Skyrim through Steam, or is it just for installation and activation? I hate any game that forces you to play through their servers, and save your games on their system. My internet goes out sometimes, and I hate not being able to play the games when that happens. If it's an MMO, that's different; but I should be able to play an FPS on just my computer, dammit.

You need to activate it through Steam and you need to have Steam running whenever you launch the game, but Steam has the option of running in off-line mode (so you don't need to always have an internet connection to play) and nothing is saved on Steam, it's all local.

I'm not sure, but I think that something like once per month Steam will require you to run it in online mode for updates or whatever, but then you can go back to running it in off-line mode. Again, I'm not sure about this because I've never gone for an entire month in off-line mode, but I do seem to recall someone once mentioning something like that on another forum.


mouser9169 wrote:

It's not just a Steam thing, it's the deception involved.

That's not the sort of thing that should be completely left out of every product description and not listed anywhere on the retail box.

On the retail box of my copy it says "Requires internet connection and Stea maccount to activate". Though it does say so on the back of the box and it's sort of easy to miss, but not any easier to miss than the system requirements. In fact I found it while searching for the lsited system requirements.


Zer0Morph wrote:

The reason these companies do it is to stop game pirating, yet people still find ways around it so all they are really doing is pissing off the consumer.

The main purpose of DRM is to combat so called "day 0 piracy", that is the piracy in the first few days after release. In the current state of the industry, marketing creates a lot of hype for a game and it's expected that most of the sales will be made in the first week/month after release. After that it will be time for the next big game. So it's important for companies to protect their games for that 1st week and that's where DRM comes in. And DRM actually does that fairly well.

Personally I don't like DRM and I think that once the protection is broken the company should remove it with a patch so it stops bothering legitemate customers.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:26 pm

Which is hilarious when you consider that there were pirated copies of Skyrim available BEFORE 11/11/11 -- apparently, Steam had done some sort of early "half-download" sort of special for those who had pre-ordered the digital version, and I guess the pirates got a hold of it and released it a few days before the actual release date. Woops! Oh well, I guess they'll just never learn. Smile
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mouser9169
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu Jan 12, 2012 7:35 pm

[quote="Dragatus"]
PGM1961 wrote:

The main purpose of DRM is to combat so called "day 0 piracy", that is the piracy in the first few days after release. In the current state of the industry, marketing creates a lot of hype for a game and it's expected that most of the sales will be made in the first week/month after release. After that it will be time for the next big game. So it's important for companies to protect their games for that 1st week and that's where DRM comes in. And DRM actually does that fairly well.

Personally I don't like DRM and I think that once the protection is broken the company should remove it with a patch so it stops bothering legitemate customers.

Steam is actually terrible for that then because it locks into a model where you can never resell your game. And if Steam (valve) goes out of business, you're basically fucked unless you get cracks for all your games.

I bought The Witcher 2 specifically because they removed all DRM from the game (day 0 piracy was averted, they got their money, so they didn't the DRM anymore). I bought a retail copy of Torchlight for the same reason (no DRM ever, not even on launch day).

Really though, I suppose we're about at the end of true PC gaming. Even MMO's are starting to fizzle, except for a few giants. The PC game section in stores has been either removed or greatly reduced in size from what it was, and more than half the games that come out are either "hidden object" mysteries and variations of bejewelled or console ports of other games.

It was nice while it lasted...

I've got to deal with my Ilok for ProTools (hardware based DRM, but it's a pretty valid assumption that if you have this program you're trying to make money with it). I refuse to go down the road of "lesser evils" with software like games. But that's just me. Consumers will vote with their wallets, and we'll be stuck with whatever most consumers are willing to put up with.

Skyrim isn't the first game I've passed on, and it certainly won't be the last.

Thanks to whoever it was for pointing out that they now have a Steam account required on the box. Maybe I missed it earlier (it was quite a while ago, but I could have sworn it wasn't on there).
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ThePhilosopher
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:00 pm

Man, talk about drama.

I've never seen someone make such an giant fuss about something so little.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:51 am

ThePhilosopher wrote:
Man, talk about drama.

I've never seen someone make such an giant fuss about something so little.
Relax, man. I used to be the same way about Steam -- until I had to use it to check out the demo of Bloodlines Resurgence. And then Skyrim. Now, I still don't like it, but I've learned to eat a shit sandwich to get my dessert.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:19 pm

WHY CAN'T I STOP WATCHING THIS VIDEO?!?!?! I'VE SEEN IT 20+ TIMES TODAY, THE MADNESS MAKE IT STOP!!!! bounce I love you I love you I love you

Voraxith, I've fallen in love with it!!! AHHHHHHH!!!! Shocked

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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:26 am

I'm really glad you like it, Zer0. I had a blast making it, too. I keep meaning to do another one, but... Then I (wait for it... WAIT FOR IT!!!) wind up just playing more Skyrim. What? Thought I was gonna say something else? Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:33 am

HAHA you're silly Voraxith! Razz ::Pet's Voraxith on the head::

That guy 331ERock is a total badass. He took a slutty night club dance song and made it amazing! I'm a fan of 331ERock and Voraxith now! HAHA! Smile

Listening to Leaving on a Jet Plane by Chantal Kreviazuk right now. Great song!!
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Sun Feb 12, 2012 6:25 pm

SKYRIM WILL STEAL YOUR SOUL GUYS. DON'T PLAY IT. OH MY GOD I CAN HEAR IT CALLING ME. I MUST....PLAY.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:12 pm

ThePhilosopher wrote:
SKYRIM WILL STEAL YOUR SOUL GUYS. DON'T PLAY IT. OH MY GOD I CAN HEAR IT CALLING ME. I MUST....PLAY.

*pokes nose into Philosopher's face to check if everything is OK*
*licks*
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:46 pm

Too late mate, got it for Christmass and played it every minute of my free time for two weeks. Then I went a little easy on it, but still spent over 70% of my free time playing it until about 10 days ago when I had to leave home for two days. Apaprently breaking the rhythm is what got me out.

And now the Construction Set has been released there's bound to be an explosion of mods. I even made one myself: Dragatus' Teleportation. If you use it and like it, don't forget to rate it. Wink

BTW, does anyone know what happened to Voraxith? It looks like he deleted both his forum account and his youtube account.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:52 pm

Dragatus wrote:

BTW, does anyone know what happened to Voraxith? It looks like he deleted both his forum account and his youtube account.

He did indeed. He signed me that something was wrong and that he wouldn't have a computer anymore, then he came back, telling me he overreacted and that everything was fine, but now he's truly gone.
Damn, all my players are doomed or what ?
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:55 pm

Claudia wrote:
Dragatus wrote:

BTW, does anyone know what happened to Voraxith? It looks like he deleted both his forum account and his youtube account.

He did indeed. He signed me that something was wrong and that he wouldn't have a computer anymore, then he came back, telling me he overreacted and that everything was fine, but now he's truly gone.
Damn, all my players are doomed or what ?

Aww shit... I thought he made a brake for himself, went on holidays of something...
F*cking loss for the forum...
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Childe of Malkav
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:19 pm

Claudia wrote:
Dragatus wrote:

BTW, does anyone know what happened to Voraxith? It looks like he deleted both his forum account and his youtube account.

He did indeed. He signed me that something was wrong and that he wouldn't have a computer anymore, then he came back, telling me he overreacted and that everything was fine, but now he's truly gone.
Damn, all my players are doomed or what ?
Hm, I don't know why or what happened. But he has cancelled his forum account. But I only do know that, because as admin I get a notification from the forum when someone cancelles their account.

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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Tue Feb 14, 2012 2:28 pm

Let's hope he is really fine...
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:34 pm

Feral wrote:
Let's hope he is really fine...

I hope so.

It's so easy for us to let our computers take over so much of our life. Maybe he just needed to pull the plug and get priorities straightened out for a while. I know I've had to do that now and then.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:33 pm

Grrr... I frakking hate Internet Explorer. I had just typed this really long and in-depth explanation of what happened to me and why I had deleted my account and had apologized for being a damned drama queen, but when I went to preview the post, it fuggered up and wiped my post instead. So you guys get the tired and grouchy old man post instead. Sorry I was gone, bad shit happened, now I'm back on a limited basis. I missed you guys a lot. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:48 am

it's good to have you back
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