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 Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used

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Zer0Morph
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PostSubject: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:33 am

Something I've been meaning to adjust in TFN for quite some time so this feature will be included in TFN 1.2. I went through every discipline and readjusted the "Supernatural Level" of each power, then set it so every cop will run in fear if they see a supernatural level 3 or higher used.

Most of the time the supernatural level matches the tier level of the discipline. For example, Thanatosis level 2: Necrosis is a tier 2 power so it will be set to a supernatural level of 2. If you use this power in front of cops, sure they'll be scared but still brave enough to stick around to fight you. However, if you were to use Thanatosis level 3: Enervation, any cop that sees you actively use it will run away and cower in fear.

I tried this in the hubs and the pier and it was awesome. Some pedestrians saw my Samedi and reported me to the police (which is also a new feature in TFN 1.2 which I'll discuss later). I was surrounded by 4 cops so I used Enervation on one of them and all 4 scattered along with all of the street pedestrians. I felt like a god..... that is until one of my hunters came running down the alley and was the only one brave enough to attack me, and eventually killed me. The hunter saved the day where normal untrained humans couldn't.

This brings me to my last point, hunters will never run when you use disciplines no matter how powerful because they are trained to understand so it doesn't scare them, which elevates them above normal humans, even police.



What do you guys think of this new feature?
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Karavolos
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:51 am

I love it and approve.
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Voraxith
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:52 am

Seconded. My next Setite god shall truly be a force to be feared...
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Feral
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:20 am

*stamps Official Seal of Approval with Bones and Fur*

Very good idea. Too bad there is no Protean in TFN Sad Using it on those pesky cops... Cool
But I will console myself with Thanatosis... Or Serpentis scratch
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Dragatus
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:46 am

Sounds good, I like it.
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Voraxith
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 11:18 am

Feral wrote:
*stamps Official Seal of Approval with Bones and Fur*

Very good idea. Too bad there is no Protean in TFN Sad Using it on those pesky cops... Cool
But I will console myself with Thanatosis... Or Serpentis scratch

No reason Malkav couldn't "borrow" the scripting for the next CE update... What a Face
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Jad.3
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:48 pm

Like it. What about Potence and stuff?
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Childe of Malkav
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:58 pm

Jad.3 wrote:
Like it. What about Potence and stuff?
Nope, they are considered "quiet" disciplines. So the cops won't notice if you use them.

- geek

P.S. If you hit a cop with potence 3 or more, he probably won't notice anything any more. Twisted Evil

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SaulottheGentle
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Mon Dec 24, 2012 12:32 am

...Stupid question, but how are police going to be afraid of a Salubri using Obeah 3: Corpre Sano? I mean, IIRC, when the Third Eye is opened, it looks detached and serene, and healing yourself, while it is indeed supernatural, isnt exactly something scary.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:24 am

Jad.3 wrote:
Like it. What about Potence and stuff?

Basically like what Malkav said. If the discipline has no visual qualities attached to it, like Fortitude, Potence, Auspex, etc... then nobody can see it. The graphical effects you see are there for the player's pleasure, nothing more, the NPCs in the game can't see it, so it won't affect them.

SaulottheGentle wrote:
...Stupid question, but how are police going to be afraid of a Salubri using Obeah 3: Corpre Sano? I mean, IIRC, when the Third Eye is opened, it looks detached and serene, and healing yourself, while it is indeed supernatural, isnt exactly something scary.

This is a good question actually. As of right now only Obeah 4 and 5 will make the cops run in fear. Obeah 1 will make regular pedestrians run in fear, but not until you reach Obeah 4: Anesthetic Touch, will the cops fear you. I looked into how to change that value and so far haven't been successful, but I'm not honestly too concerned with level 4 freaking out the cops, I'm ok with that.

What are your opinions on this if I am able to figure out a way to change it later on?
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Jad.3
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:31 am

You may proceed.
Are there other powers like Corpre Sano?
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Childe of Malkav
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:33 am

Hm, if I saw a freak with a third eye on the forehead doing weird stuff in the street, I wouldn't stand around watching. I'd first find a secure place and look deeper into it from there.

- geek

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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:20 pm

Ain't your style more in the lines of sending shovelheads at the freak to test it and then try to capture it so you can experiment?
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:43 am

Keep in mind that in TFN the Salubri also has a bluish glow and lightning coursing over his/her body.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:24 am

Zer0Morph wrote:
If the discipline has no visual qualities attached to it, like Fortitude, Potence, Auspex, etc... then nobody can see it. The graphical effects you see are there for the player's pleasure, nothing more, the NPCs in the game can't see it, so it won't affect them.
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Childe of Malkav
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:49 am

Karavolos wrote:
Ain't your style more in the lines of sending shovelheads at the freak to test it and then try to capture it so you can experiment?
Yep, if I can get some Ravnos fledglings to do the job...

- geek

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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:57 am

Unlikely these days, but hey; if you can get it to work then good for you.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 7:46 am

Jad.3 wrote:
Zer0Morph wrote:
If the discipline has no visual qualities attached to it, like Fortitude, Potence, Auspex, etc... then nobody can see it. The graphical effects you see are there for the player's pleasure, nothing more, the NPCs in the game can't see it, so it won't affect them.

Yes, but Obeah causes Masquerade violations if you ru naround with it activated so obviously the NPCs can see something. Might as well be the blue glow.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 7:54 am

I think what they see is the third eye.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:14 pm

IIRC the first two levels aren't supposed to activate the eye though and they still cause a violation.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:16 pm

Looks like a job for Zer0morph! Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:33 pm

I have an idea, but I dont know how people will look at it.
I forget on what level of Obeah that causes Lightning to rain down on you and that you gain Obeahs bonuses, but with the system of police running away, I was thinking...

Maybe on higher levels of Obeah (and/or Daimonion, depending on if Zero wants to input it), maybe even hunters could run away as well? Think about it, from what loading screens say, apparently some hunters have only faced lesser supernaturals (such as Fledgelings/Neonates, and possibly some...newly initiated werewolves?).

In this game, you can get up to level 5 in disciplines (Kind of averted in certain places, like Level 5 Dementation in CE, Lingering Malise, is either level 6 or 7 of Dementation) in a matter of a month rather than years (The serial killer for example was embraced by a Gangrel sometime after his family was killed. The cop at the beginning notes that a similar killing took place a few years ago. He had about X years of Mastery with Protean under his belt).

Lets also look at the Level 5 of Obeah and Daimonion respectively. Level 5 Obeah, Wrath of the Heavens, wraps your body in heavenly lightning as you gets powerful defensively and offensivlely. Level 5 Daimonion, on the other hand, Concordance, wraps your body in Hellfire and Blood as a demon enters to grant you it's strength and temporary invulnerability.

Talking from conjecture, no matter how trained of a hunter you are, it would no doubt be morale breaking and brick shitting to see someone suddenly be powered up from Heaven or to be facing a raging demon wrapped in fire.

What I suggest is that maybe Obeah and/or Daimonion 5 could cause hunters to run away, but depending on what level they are, this can change.
Skin-Head - Black Shirt Hunter: Runs away until killed.
Female - Red Jump suit hunter: Runs away, but returns after 10 seconds.
Stereotypical Van-Hellsing Hunter: Cowers, but attacks after 5 Seconds
Grunfield Bach: Doesn't cower at all, being a badass hunter as he is.

To even the field abit, I think that since this idea follows the Baali and Salubri almost exclusively, I think that as you get Masquerade violations, some other vampires also join the fray of hunting you, more specifically, the Tremere, as the Baali and Salubri...well, they have to cover up their mistakes, with Baali hiding amongst them and Salubri being hunted by the get-go by them.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Thu Dec 27, 2012 9:40 am

It's true, most of the effects you see and hear for Obeah and for the player only, the NPCs don't see it or hear it, like the lightning n such. However a ghostly third eye DOES appear on the forehead of the Salubri making it a violation to use around kine.

@Saulot

That's an interesting proposition. About the most that I could code would be for the hunters to either run in fear or stay and fight. I wouldn't know how to make them run away for x seconds then come back and fight. Those kinds of requests are above my pay grade however Malkav might be able to python that, he's alot smarter than I am.

I do see your point however I'm not sure, for gameplay purposes, that I would want my hunters running away from Daimonoin/Obeah 5. It would seem like those 2 disciplines would be an ultimate "get out of trouble" button. I guess when I thought about it, the greatest power that hunters have is the ability to calm their own fears so when others flee from vampiric terror, the hunter stays to slay the undead beasts.

I dunno, something to think about I guess. Let's see what others say?

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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:59 am

Well, I understand. I'm more of a bystander that gives suggestions and (as impolite as it sounds) leaves it to the developers to explain what can and cant be done.
I would also like to say that if any of my suggestions sound like demands, I do not mean for them to sound like that and I apologize for it. I've been on a different forum where people have demanded things to be added, so I've kinda wired it into my system to try not to make it as such or sound as such.
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PostSubject: Re: Cops run in fear when higher level disciplines are used   Thu Dec 27, 2012 7:02 pm

Hm, it might be possible to make hunters run from certain discipline levels, and later return to fight. If supernatural fight and flee are tweakable character parameters.

You could also make them flee from certain disciplines and come back later. But that would require setting an Events_Player on every map with hunters. And then I'm not sure if it is possible to make it happen for certain levels only.

In any case I'd suggest to add another masquerade violation to any script that makes a hunter flee. Or as Unicorn suggested, send some Tremere (or perhaps an Asssamite contracted by the Tremere) after the pc.

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