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ThePhilosopher
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:42 am

I interrupt this pointless bickering to sway this topic into something of far greater importance: Me.

After gazing upon my new perfect form, you may all prostrate thineselves in front of Me and sing thine hymns of worship, while I devise a great plan of evildom to bind the pinscher Feral eternaly into my service.

However, if you are too much filled with plebian blood that you're incapable of percepting the radiance of my brilliance, then I grant you leave to continue crawling in lesser topics of discussion.
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Jad.3
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 5:18 am

Not now, Phil! Go stare in a mirror or something!

My dear Dragatus. Everybody can say "No." But can you say "Yes"? Sally can, so in this the Karavolos' illusion is beating you! A Salubri is better than Tremere, yay! Laughing

To be fair,
a) I recall vaguely that there are targeted and passive disciplines, Protean being passive, which means its levels stack. You can't use claws without the eyes. Conversion to targeted discipline might mean we would use each level separatedly.
b) Come up with something already! Smile Don't mind the levels. Just something doable and fun.

I am actually starting to think this topic deviated from its original intent. How... unexpected. And I think Dual Form would be fun - create a copy of yourself for 30sec. that immediatelly frenzies and attacks hostiles. If it is destroyed before time runs out, loose blood and health.
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SaulottheGentle
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:28 am

Dragatus wrote:
1. We all know Protean 3 in the p&p version is Earthmeld. I was asking what Protean 3 does in Bloodlines the computer game becasue it's been so long since I've played a Gangrel.

2. The taxi driver being Caine is a popular hypothesis, but it isn't necessarily true. He is certainly a low generation vampire, but it doesn't fit Caine's personality to get so involved in local kindred affairs. He's been busy not giving a fuck for thosuands of years (including the fun with Carthage, the purging of the Salubri by the Tremere, and the anarch revolt when several antedelluvians were thought to be dusted) and then he suddenly changes his mind in order to rid a single city of a little shit that barely qualifies as an elder?

3. You haven't actually adressed either my arguments which are:
a) From what Malkav said I understand that he would like to make Protean more like in the p&p version.
b) Flesh of Marble wouldn't produce interesting gameplay (Gangrel already have Fortitude) and Dual Form would be wierd. Though that lat one may be just me. I hate uncontrolable companions and prefers to go solo.

1: Ok, Protean 3 should be "Will of the Wolves", giving +2 to Stamina.

2: Well, considering his age, he could be doing it for the lulz.

3:
A) Well, please specify what aspect then. I am addressing the PnP Protean. That's what the argument on why the Vanilla disciplines not following PnP rules are plausible given the possible theory as to why it is and who is behind it. The part I specified with having even Antedeluvian levels of disciplines was also part of it.

B) Apologies if my entire response sounds rude, and it's not supposed to be, but there's more to Protean than the aftermentioned abilities. Such as "Body of the Sun", or "Shape of the Inner Beast".
http://reference.l2fury.com/index.php?title=Protean
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Karavolos
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:58 am

Regarding the taxi driver, I heard a theory which said he is a Malkavian who believes himself to be Caine, hard to say though.
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Dragatus
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 1:22 pm

@ThePhilosopher

Hey there, sexy.


@Jad.3

If you go back and re-read the thread you will find that I have never said it was a bad idea to make Protean a targeted discipline. All I've said is that Flesh of Marble and Dual Form wouldn't be good choices to replace whatever Protean does at rank 3 in the vanilla game, especially if the goal was to make the discipline more like in the p&p game.

And my understanding of "more like the p&p game" is that each power of a discipline would do what it does in the p&p game (as much as is possible within the limiations of the game) and that each power would also be at the same rank as it is in the p&p game.

I don't know for sure what Malkav meant with the phrase, you'll have to ask him for that.


@Sally

IMO those all sound rather powerful for a rank 3 power.
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:20 pm

ThePhilosopher wrote:
I interrupt this pointless bickering to sway this topic into something of far greater importance: Me.

After gazing upon my new perfect form, you may all prostrate thineselves in front of Me and sing thine hymns of worship, while I devise a great plan of evildom to bind the pinscher Feral eternaly into my service.

However, if you are too much filled with plebian blood that you're incapable of percepting the radiance of my brilliance, then I grant you leave to continue crawling in lesser topics of discussion.

lol! lol! lol!

Well... The new avatar of yours is still creepy, but better than the previous one. I therefore grant you a Minor Boon.

Eternal service... *puts paws on snout and tries to stop choking*
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Jad.3
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:33 pm

@ Dragatus:
If you go back and re-read the thread you will see that Earthmeld would be quite pointless. So would you please stop saying what is bad idea and come up with an idea (note that I am not saying "good," I mean "any") of your own? It is called being constructive Wink

Aah, arguing on the internet... Smile
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SaulottheGentle
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:43 pm

Well, let's get all of the plot points in order. We all are thinking about what could be added to Protean that is within PnP rules. However, let's look at Protean in general.

http://reference.l2fury.com/index.php?title=Protean

As you all can see, Protean has many abilities within the respective levels. However, while it is good to see how much is available, it would be easier to cancel out most of Protean, since most aren't replicable in VTMB. The reason why most wont work is because most of Protean is specifically about changing ones form into that of an animal, many animals, incorpreal forms, digging through earth and vice versa. It would be better to look at the ones that can most likely be replicable. Out of the list, the ones that personally stand out for me are:

Shape of the Beast's Wrath (A suped up version of the Warform), Shape of the Inner Beast (The beast's true form and frenzy), Adaptation (Could raise Defense?), Inward Focus (Potence + Fortitude + Celerity), Dual Form, Body of the Sun, and Flesh of Marble (the last three are exactly as it says on the can).

However, even in these, these are a few points for which, in my own opinion, the abilities should be crossed off.
Shape of the Beast's Wrath sounds awesome and all, but it's basically the Warform with higher stats. Inward Focus sounds awesome, but I feel that it would be too overkill in the player's hands. Dual Form is unique and does indeed sound fun, but this isn't possible without Comp Mod, and Claudia explicitly said that it's an extreme bitch to handle when it comes to merging and coding. Flesh of Marble also sounds fun, but were it included, it would outright make Fortitude redundant, which is a no-no when it comes to VTM. Same for Body of the Sun, as it's Protean 10 and would be TOO overkill.
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Dragatus
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:21 pm

That's kind of what I've been saying all along.
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Jad.3
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:32 pm

Wow, were you? And what do you think we (M.) should add, implement?
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Feral
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Sat Jun 08, 2013 7:16 am

The two I would like to see are Shape of the Beast and Mist form.
Both worked fine in Redemption, so... Wolf form should deal Strenght + 2 Aggrevated damage. Plus fun of running on all fours and rising fur on pedestrians. Laughing
Mist form could be the wait out and regenerate safely form. Be it in Warehouse, Warrens... Any big fight. Only fire and sunlight can hurt Cainite in this form, so it would be a safe heaven. As such, Bloodtimer should run, maybe even faster, and the power itself should be expensive in BP terms, so not to make it overkill.

*turns around for a belly rub*
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Jad.3
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Sat Jun 08, 2013 8:36 am

Oh well, there is a first time for everything.
*rubs Feral's belly*
Who's a good boy? Whoo's a good booy?
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Feral
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PostSubject: Re: Protean   Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:05 am

Jad.3 wrote:
Oh well, there is a first time for everything.
*rubs Feral's belly*
Who's a good boy? Whoo's a good booy?

*wags, whines and tries to lick Jad's hand*

Wait, when was the last time we hed a Viniculum?
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