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Maxus Corvin
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PostSubject: Morrowind   Tue Dec 31, 2013 11:09 pm

Perhaps the case where a thread like this is not needed, however, there already is one for Oblivion, and perhaps one or two for Skyrim. Given how much people will mention this game as being the best in the series, why not have a thread about it?

But the odd part, is that while I will say that I have at least liked what I have seen of the game so far, overall I would not call the game bad, by any means. I would at least not consider comparing thing so easily back to Morrowind. The graphics of the game are not really a factor for me, as I obviously have no issue with Redemption's graphics either. It's more the functionality of a game, and what the story is. From what I have seen so far, I want to see more.

However, there are a few problems I have noticed(not really bugs, though), which I find it odd that it was even done. Though they are not big things, they are what makes me curious as to why they are liked.

-Topic Insults
Though I do not think exactly that is the right things to call it. But the thing I mean by this, is when you get a quest from a character, and then you chose the same topic again, which I keep thinking will have the character telling me more about it. But no - instead they chose to say something to the effect of "Yes, that is where you should be going.". Which really just has me feel that many characters in the game are almost designed to be rude to the player, since asking about things in that fashion usually does elicit that sort of response. Still, it likely isn't every character, since it is likely that some will do as expected, and tell more about the topic.

-No Respect, No Respect at all.
Now, this is an odd one. While I do understand there is the idea that you have to earn respect, and I can accept that, it seems that it almost doesn't matter. What I refer to, is the fact that most of the factions seem to believe that you can do NOTHING upon joining the faction. Now, I have only joined the Mages Guild(in Balmora, before even talking to Caius, I believe), and House Telvanni. Seems for both you start out picking flowers and mushrooms, and being a delivery boy(I am playing a male dunmer, sort of making a backstory to one of my Oblivion characters[though it might be a bit odd]). Perhaps it isn't the worst approach, but I don't think the game doesn't reference the rank requirements(unless you don't meet them), and most of the quests seem to progress without them. However, I just find it a little odd that you can be skilled in magic, and in joining both factions that champion it, you have to run off for various tasks, which might not implicitly require the use of magic.

Other than that, I find it odd that some of the boats or the Silt Striders won't offer travel to certain places, even if they aren't that far away, or it would make sense if it went there. A minor problem though. As for the journal, well, good thing I have Tribunal.
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ThePhilosopher
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Wed Jan 01, 2014 1:55 am

You should use Morrowind Graphics and Sound Overhaul. Makes it so not everything in the game looks like a fucking triangle.

In factions, you need two things to level up in ranks: meet the requirements and do faction quests. The requeriments are so that a character must fit a certain style for a certain faction i.e Telvanni and Mages Guild requeriments involve stats like Intelligence and Willpower, and magical skills.

Faction ranks affect three things: How much disposition faction-friendly NPCs have, faction trainers you can use and faction quests avaiable to you. So if you try to play as a warrior in the mages guild, even if you finish the quests warhammering everything, there will come a time where there will be no quests avaiable to you because of your rank.

This is a much better system than Skyrim and maybe worse than Oblivion's. In Skyrim you could become Archmage in about two in-game days and without casting a single spell. In Oblivion the game didn't force any skill or attribute checks, but the quests were made in a way to greatly favor certain playstyles.

My first character was also a Mages Guild/Telvanni, and by the end of the questlines you get plenty of respect, you can be sure of that  Laughing
In Skyrim, you could walk around with archmage robes and people would still say "maybe you should join the mages college".
In Oblivion people didn't mention faction ranks at all.
In Morrowind, faction members treat you respectfully after you reached the top positions. No one else seems to care though
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Maxus Corvin
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:33 am

ThePhilosopher wrote:
You should use Morrowind Graphics and Sound Overhaul. Makes it so not everything in the game looks like a fucking triangle.

I'm not running too many mods with the game, mostly just things that make characters look better and such. I am planning to look into that though.

Quote :

In factions, you need two things to level up in ranks: meet the requirements and do faction quests. The requeriments are so that a character must fit a certain style for a certain faction i.e Telvanni and Mages Guild requeriments involve stats like Intelligence and Willpower, and magical skills.

Yeah, my character is Mouth rank in House Telvanni. For the Mages Guild, still an associate since I have only done one quest for it, and the second I have, but haven't gathered the items yet. For Telvanni, I haven't really had issues with getting the ranks, at least not due to the skill requirements. The character is a Nightblade class, although I've been using Destruction quite a bit(it's at 60+, I believe). I've been using the other magic skills too, although I haven't done anything with alchemy yet.

Quote :
In Oblivion people didn't mention faction ranks at all.

At least for the Mages Guild, they do(mostly in the Arcane University, or the Guild halls in other cities). I've heard a few NPC's I've passed by say something like "Greetings, Conjurer", or similar for other ranks. The game even has the lines to recognize you as Archmage, more than just when given the rank(although this might be something the patch had to fix, I think).

I don't know if it happens in Oblivion's other factions, I imagine it might for the Thieves guild(although I've only played through that once, and have a character about two/three quests into it now), or the Fighters Guild, but I've only done that once.

Also, it seems that many characters in Morrowind will refer to the player as "Outlander". Which, while obviously true, it makes sense if playing anything but a dunmer. If playing as a Dunmer though, it would only make sense for them to call you that if they knew specifically that you were not from Morrowind(like in Seyda Neen). Elsewhere, how would they know? Sure, you could be from elsewhere(and not be a Khajiit), but it's unlikely they could be so specific.
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Wed Jan 01, 2014 2:07 pm

First off: The elders scrolls games are made by pretty limited amount of developers. So there will always be some limitations and bugs to the games, but mod support has always fixed it (mostly) which is why all TES games have very good mod support to begin with. It wasn't until Skyrim (maybe a bit after oblivion) that the studio REALLY flourished, it always had it's core players, but skyrim really spread out it's popularity.

Second, the game is rather on the older side, disregarding the graphics (there are still many old games which are superior to several current day games thanks to the audience they cater to these days), tech in those days was limited. And the mentioning of your guild rank is mostly a thing, but the way they treat you, has always been a missing feature in all TES games, most likely cause they require a lot of work better spent on fixing the gameworld.

Third, you have to change your mental image of the world to a medieval setting. You don't have CCTV and rapid response cops everywhere, or a real punishment system that is (mostly) foul proof with active attempts to avoid corruption. People are very distrustful, they pay with their money for your services, not for your good company. They might be polite, but they have no real reason to like you just as much as the second traveler they come across every other day. It's a hard knocks life. Also, just because you're some fancy archmage in the big city, doesn't mean you'll be known to others in remote small villages, there is no newspaper, phone or internet, back in those days, news spread via traveling merchants whom brought the latest news or rumors, IF they even made it in once piece because of bandits or other strokes of bad luck.
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Wed Jan 01, 2014 3:53 pm

Maxus Corvin wrote:

Also, it seems that many characters in Morrowind will refer to the player as "Outlander". Which, while obviously true, it makes sense if playing anything but a dunmer. If playing as a Dunmer though, it would only make sense for them to call you that if they knew specifically that you were not from Morrowind(like in Seyda Neen). Elsewhere, how would they know? Sure, you could be from elsewhere(and not be a Khajiit), but it's unlikely they could be so specific.

Actually certain NPCs will tell you that they can tell it by your accent.

Ah, Morrowind. Best TES game as far as I'm concerned. LAter games may have improved graphics and gameplay, but that's not what TES is really about. The thing that TES does better than any series is the same thing that Morrowind does better than any other TES game. And that is creating a rich and fascinating world for you to explore.
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Thu Jan 02, 2014 6:25 am

I can only agree, though I can't wait to see how Skywind will turn out. It's a conversion of Morrowind (and its expansions) to the Skyrim engine, and that is, in my opinion, the only thing TES III could need (perhaps a fix of the stupid CTD every 5 minutes or so, but that thing is a mystery still).
I loved the feeling of Skyrim, though the graphics didn't do the trick for me (I don't like it too fancy), but nothing can touch Morrowind concerning lore and main quest. It always made me feel like I actually matter, like I'm really the hero of the story, not some errand boy (Oblivion) or just an adventurer with a unique gimmick (Skyrim). To each their own, though.

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Maxus Corvin
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:11 am

Okay, so as it stands, I've only joined three factions in the game, one of them being required for the main quest.

House Telvanni
-Spellwright

Mages Guild
-Associate

Blades
-Journeyman

The only other I'm thinking of joining with this character would be the Temple(even if it might not make much sense for a roleplay standpoint - might find a reason regardless), if only to see the rather amusing oddity that transpires at some point with the main quest, for myself. The only thing I really want to be careful of, is killing someone before I'm supposed to. I don't think I'll be finishing the Mages guild, so unless House Telvanni or the Temple will cause such a problem, I should be okay in that respect.

Other than that, I will at least be doing Bloodmoon(actually did already start it, but haven't really done any of the quests) with the character as well. Mostly because I have the idea that, by the time the character goes to Cyrodiil, he is actually a Werewolf.

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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Tue Jan 28, 2014 8:23 am

Ah, Morrowind! It truly is the best game in the TES series. The writings in it are so beautifully written and the story is the best out of all the other game entries. I'd love to get more into talking about it right now, but I have class in a little bit.
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Tue Jan 28, 2014 10:33 am

I'd argue that Daggerfall's story is possibly even better than Morrowind's, but the way it's told is worse ("Go to dungeon X to get item Y and I will tell you a bit about what happened.")
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Maxus Corvin
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Tue Nov 03, 2015 5:39 am

Oh the many uses of a shovel.

Maybe it is that I have no or little idea as to what I am talking about, but I get the impression that some do not know what roleplay means. At least to the effect where the seemingly accepted view of it is that, in trying to play your character, you will be limited in every way possible, many of these ways being nothing more than arbitrary limits that you place on your character, but otherwise the gameplay doesn't care that you aren't doing something.

Otherwise, it's more about the "realism" of a game, meaning several things that easily tend to bog down the story. "Oh I can't go off and fight the dragon now, I need to SLEEP!". Or, "You want me to go WHERE? You know it is FREEZING there, right?" Still, more to the point, is an easily annoying thing that I've found in Morrowind that, even if I know about why it is there, to me, it is basically broken, for a few reasons.

So I did a re-install of Morrowind, and tried MGSO. Well, for whatever reason, halfway through the process, the ExeOpt program would run, crash, and basically stop the whole process in it's tracks. Might try that again, but for now, I have a few interesting mods that do make the game better.

But something I'd been doing for Skyrim, is really trying to make a character that does not require injections of story into the gameplay, no real forced bits of story that DO NOT happen within the gameplay. Maybe some small things that don't really force me to go out of my way to play a character and not just the game, but not much more than that. However, in somewhat trying this for Morrowind, I came across a rather large problem. So my idea for the character was that, she basically has a certain disdain for her entire culture, and does not really give a shit, much less two, about the posturing of the Tribunal or the Empire. I can imagine her combination of shock and horror when first being told where the boat was going. Why she was in the Imperial prison? Not randomly, as I'd think that she might have done something quite deliberate, which unfortunately landed her there. But where the problem comes in, is that when it comes to something which may be obvious, I thought, why not. This would obviously be the idea of becoming a Vampire, which she would have no problems with. I'm sure that what follows, is not a surprise.

In Sunlight? Yeah, you dead. Now, I know the idea behind this. I can even see that for Morrowind, being a Vampire long term was clearly not something Bethesda intended, likely meaning it to be more a mistake on the player's part, and not actually something that is deliberate. Obviously this changes in Oblivion, and even more in Skyrim. But here it is so restrictive that there is almost no point in trying to play a Vampire. Nevermind the other issue, which I know I do not have to explain.

So did I give up? Almost. Still might with how buggy this thing seems, which is mostly random freezes and the like, along with the fact that the game doesn't really support widescreen, and it is tricky to get it to do so. However, for the issues with Vampires, I have the solution. Which may be well known, but still.

Vampire Realism II
Vampire's Embrace

When it comes to the Sun Damage(which is completely wrong, since the Sun doesn't damage you, it KILLS YOU), Arkay can stuff it, I turned it off. As for the fact that very few people are willing to talk? Well they suddenly are a lot more talkative, and don't care that I am a Vampire. Why? Simple, that is a limitation I don't want to deal with. Thal'vyn is a Vampire, and perfectly willing to stay that way.
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:40 am

I remember using mod called Underground to get me "vampire" kick out of Morrowind, dunno if I used anything else to go along with it tho (I think I used some ring which nullified the damage from the Sun).

But yeah... it was really annoying in Morrowind if you were a vampire, werewolf or diseased. Noone knows that you're powerful mage who could cast nuclear bombs, that you've killed avatars of daedric gods or many of the other achievements, yet everyone is an expert on those 3 things >_>
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Maxus Corvin
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:51 am

Garlik wrote:
I remember using mod called Underground to get me "vampire" kick out of Morrowind, dunno if I used anything else to go along with it tho (I think I used some ring which nullified the damage from the Sun).

I think I did see a mod on the Nexus that added a ring or Amulet that had that effect, but the fact that if you take it off on accident in the middle of the day, or you have to wear something else that takes that slot in a dungeon, and when you come out...instant death. Not what I was looking for. I was honestly looking for a mod like the ones for Oblivion and Skyrim, that simply removed the sun damage from the game, if not just making the effect do nothing. But those two mods accomplish that and more, and with options.

Garlik wrote:

But yeah... it was really annoying in Morrowind if you were a vampire, werewolf or diseased. Noone knows that you're powerful mage who could cast nuclear bombs, that you've killed avatars of daedric gods or many of the other achievements, yet everyone is an expert on those 3 things >_>

Which is technically a problem that for many things in Morrowind, although Oblivion and Skyrim share the same problem in places. Like the obvious issue in Morrowind where you join a faction, and then....EVERYONE knows you are in that faction, and thus either like you more or hate you more for it. Play a Werewolf(although I have not really gotten to far into Bloodmoon), and if you transform once when seen doing so....All of Solstiem and Vvardenfell now knows...HOW?
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Tue Nov 03, 2015 7:16 am

Yeah... doesn't make any sense at all that everyone knows all of the sudden, it's like everyone is subscribed to news about you. And if it is just because it's news about werewolf (and not because it's you) then you should quite often hear news about other werewolves in the area.

Plus there's thingy with hiding your identity, you may wear a generic full armor with helmet that completely covers your face, but everyone know it's you who committed the crime (or turned) even if noone was close enough to you to see your face since you've put on that armor, let alone when you were committing it. And even if you've killed the only witness after that.

And there's always the annoying thing with stolen items and fencing them. I can understand if it is something specific, some family heirloom or something, but generic spoon or a bowl, plate, bucket, anything really, if it's stolen each merchant knows it is, as if it's engraved or marked and it certainly is "completely different" from same stuff you find in dungeons and abandoned homes. Or well... Apples, breads and other types of food too.
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Maxus Corvin
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Fri Nov 06, 2015 4:23 am

Garlik wrote:

And there's always the annoying thing with stolen items and fencing them. I can understand if it is something specific, some family heirloom or something, but generic spoon or a bowl, plate, bucket, anything really, if it's stolen each merchant knows it is, as if it's engraved or marked and it certainly is "completely different" from same stuff you find in dungeons and abandoned homes. Or well... Apples, breads and other types of food too.

Mainly what I'm after with this character is to find a set of Flame Atronach armor, which a mod I have adds to them, making the armor wearable. Doesn't seem like there are too many of them in the game though, which does make sense. Eh, maybe a set of the Ordinator armor if possible - I don't know, maybe it's a faux pas since I've joined the Temple with this character(the character reason for that? It will make more sense later), I don't know. Plus added a mod that makes Vivec female, and I really want to get to a point in some questline to meet...well, her, in this case.

Really wish there was a similar mod for the Flame Atronach armor in Skyrim.

As for stolen stuff, I haven't stolen anything in Morrowind yet. Well...save for obviously cleaning out that one unsupervised room just before "talking to the captain", but that isn't exactly considered stolen. Still, even Skyrim has the problem of, say you have nine Sweetrolls, and then steal one....now all of them are considered stolen until you eat or drop one. Possibly that stolen flag should make it a separate item, but meh, its not too much of a problem.

What?
This was not here last time...

Seems it was planned for the Sixth House to have a more, apparent effect on the island as the MQ proceeds. Bethesda didn't have it in the vanilla game, but well, mods.
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Fri Nov 06, 2015 9:35 am

Maxus, what mod makes the 6th House stuff pop up? :3
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Maxus Corvin
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PostSubject: Re: Morrowind   Fri Nov 06, 2015 9:49 am

SaulottheGentle wrote:
Maxus, what mod makes the 6th House stuff pop up? :3

Main Quest Enhancers

I haven't seen too much of the content added by this mod, since I'm only up to the Ashlander Informant. Not sure if I want to complete the Temple quests first or not.


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