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 Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch

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Cretino
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:13 pm

Basketball
Who uses blood dolls anyway, when you can just go behind people? Or sewer rats...
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Tue Nov 17, 2015 1:53 am

I've always been a predator, stalking people in dark alleyways. Or I just punch prostitutes when the cops weren't looking and run after them into said dark alleyway. Or I got good at haggle and gave the prostitutes their $5. So yeah, I never really bothered that much with blood dolls.

How about playing a Warrior of Set next? They're new, you still have your fancy Presence, and you also get to smash things with Potence. Come to think of it, Warriors of Set actually have 2 out of 3 disciplines in common with Brujah.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:13 pm

Yeah! And Obfuscate for triple damage! Every kine dies instantly, and most kindred won't know what hit them!!
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 2:04 am

Warriors of Set don't have Obfuscate. They have Potence instead, which is how they get to share 2 disciplines with Brujah.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:24 pm

@Dragatus wrote:
Warriors of Set don't have Obfuscate. They have Potence instead, which is how they get to share 2 disciplines with Brujah.

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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:38 pm

Not sure I believe you. "Brujah" and "plan" don't fit well together. Wink
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:46 pm

Of course Brujah make plans. Like "We go in, smash everything, take what we need and leave..."

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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 5:49 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:16 pm

OK, fine. I have to concde a point there with Jack. Some Brujah do make plans.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:30 pm

Perfect meme EVER!

Some older Brujah DO make plans, just not me, hehe. Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:32 pm

@Zer0Morph wrote:
Perfect meme EVER!

Some older Brujah DO make plans, just not me, hehe. Razz

Called it!
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:34 am

@Zer0Morph wrote:
At Presence level 3, whenever a player speaks to an NPC, Presence is activated giving the player a +1 to Seduction and Intimidate.
When you say "activated", does this mean the discipline is used, as in, costs blood?  

What about Elysium?  Do players get a passive bonus, or is this denied, since disciplines CAN'T be activated?




Who's this hot guy, is this you?

Quote :
ideas keep cropping up on small things that I could do to improve the game further
How about allowing you to use Seduction on any NPC to feed in public, not just blood dolls?

Quote :
After that, I met up with Beckett and sure enough, my Presence didn't affect him in dialogue, he's just too strong for that. I went back and spoke with Bertram and my Presence didn't affect him either.
Do Beckett and Bertram have dialog options?  Do they have options for high persuade/seduce/intimidate?  I can't recall offhand.

Quote :
I'm leaning heavily on the Baali clan but I'm not sure.
I recommend it.  I did a play of 131 as Baali and felt the L3 Doimoinon power was ridiculously OP.  I killed Ming Xiao in under a minute, taking no damage.  A power causing 20% damage, paralyzing, only L3, and only costing 1 blood??  Definitely needs a nerf (if you haven't already addressed this specific discipline since).
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:01 pm

Quote :
When you say "activated", does this mean the discipline is used, as in, costs blood?

What about Elysium? Do players get a passive bonus, or is this denied, since disciplines CAN'T be activated?

When I say activated, I mean the passive buffs automatically get enabled during the dialogue process, then turns off after dialogue is done. This is automatic and does not cost blood to use.

This also works in Elysium areas, much in the way Blood Buff can be used to pick locks in Elysium. Some of the older kindred like Jack, Bertram, Beckett, etc... will resist your Presence however you will still see a message appear explaining this.

Quote :
Who's this hot guy, is this you?

Haha, no! That's ToddEVF, the Twitch streamer who will be hosting our pre-release party for 1.4 next week! Smile

Quote :
How about allowing you to use Seduction on any NPC to feed in public, not just blood dolls?

This is a solid idea, one that I've been toying with for some time now. The problem is getting every NPC a set of voiced lines to go with it, that's the challenge. I wouldn't want to use the same voice and lines over and over again.

Quote :
Do Beckett and Bertram have dialog options? Do they have options for high persuade/seduce/intimidate? I can't recall offhand.

I know they can train your character to increase their stats, but I don't think this is persuade/seduce/intimidate dependent, but rather what your current score is when the training lines appear.

Quote :
I recommend it. I did a play of 131 as Baali and felt the L3 Doimoinon power was ridiculously OP. I killed Ming Xiao in under a minute, taking no damage. A power causing 20% damage, paralyzing, only L3, and only costing 1 blood?? Definitely needs a nerf (if you haven't already addressed this specific discipline since).

I appreciate the feedback and agree with you. This is something I'll look at today to see what can be done. Thanks for the feedback on that.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Thu Nov 19, 2015 7:53 pm

Quote :
I recommend it. I did a play of 131 as Baali and felt the L3 Doimoinon power was ridiculously OP. I killed Ming Xiao in under a minute, taking no damage. A power causing 20% damage, paralyzing, only L3, and only costing 1 blood?? Definitely needs a nerf (if you haven't already addressed this specific discipline since).

I just wanted to come back to this thread and say that I took your advice on Conflagration and toned down both the damage and the paralyzing effect to supernaturals. It was previously 20-30% damage and 5 seconds of paralyzing to supernaturals, but it's now 10-20% damage and 3 seconds of paralyzing to supernaturals. I bumped up the human damage to 20-30% because of how frail they are.

Hopefully this will rebalance Daimoinon as a whole as well.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Thu Nov 19, 2015 8:34 pm

@Zer0Morph wrote:
Haha, no! That's ToddEVF, the Twitch streamer who will be hosting our pre-release party for 1.4 next week! Smile

Ah, okay.  Normally when I watch guys live they're... doing something else.  But I can still enjoy watching a guy play with himself... I mean, by himself.  : P

Quote :
The problem is getting every NPC a set of voiced lines to go with it, that's the challenge. I wouldn't want to use the same voice and lines over and over again.
IMHO, no matter how many lines you had voiced, they would become annoying after a while.  That's just a matter of hearing anything over and over, be it professionally voiced lines from a studio, or amateur voiced from a mod.

Speaking for myself, I'd not only rather have an NPC Seduction option sooner as opposed to waiting for a sufficient number of voiced lines to be made, but even afterwards I'd want the feeding to be silent. Just as when you were toying with the sparkles for the Presence effect in dialog and some gamers didn't like it, I'd prefer silent feeding.  Just my two coppers, FWIW.

Quote :
I appreciate the feedback and agree with you. This is something I'll look at today to see what can be done. Thanks for the feedback on that.
No, thank you!  We appreciate all the time and effort you've put into TFN.  Maybe you could let us bask in your awesomeness with... a live show?  ; )

Quote :
Hopefully this will rebalance Daimoinon as a whole as well.

Wow, fast and efficient!  : )

I strongly suggest you do your new playthrough as a Baali, with emphasis on that discipline.  See what you think about the L3-L5 powers.  In my play I didn't use the L5 power, so I can't comment.  The clan as a whole was amazingly strong, not only with Conflagration, but invisibility as well, on top of the xp bonus.  I just sailed through the whole game.  Here's my final sheet, if you're interested:

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m95/Aeroldoth/VTMB%20Baali_zpsot45jcfk.png

In my ignorant opinion, I would raise Conflagration to L4 or L5, have it cause set damage instead of percentage (or only like 5% if you keep percentage), remove the paralysis for supernaturals, and/or possibly raise the blood cost and cooldown timer.  Conflagration really was ridiculously OP, and I would smack it hard with the nerf hammer.

While on the subject, is there any reason you didn't make the L1 power permanent?  It seems silly to have a power that costs no blood, require activation.  Nos get x3 blood from rats without having to activate anything... it would make sense for Baali's bonus to work the same way.  The animation for the effect is, without a doubt, friggin GORGEOUS, so I didn't really mind, but thought I'd mention it.  : )

Apologies if my comments lead you to tinker, instead of testing the mod for final release.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:46 am

@Aeroldoth wrote:

Ah, okay.  Normally when I watch guys live they're... doing something else.  But I can still enjoy watching a guy play with himself... I mean, by himself.  : P

Very Happy

Quote :

Speaking for myself, I'd not only rather have an NPC Seduction option sooner as opposed to waiting for a sufficient number of voiced lines to be made, but even afterwards I'd want the feeding to be silent. Just as when you were toying with the sparkles for the Presence effect in dialog and some gamers didn't like it, I'd prefer silent feeding.  Just my two coppers, FWIW.

Actually, that's not a bad idea. Hey Zer0, do you think it would be possible to make it so that if you try to feed on someone on the street and you have Presence activated, it triggers a seduction feeding instead of a force feeding? Maybe only at higher ranks of the dsicipline to keep it from being OP?

Quote :
In my ignorant opinion, I would raise Conflagration to L4 or L5, have it cause set damage instead of percentage (or only like 5% if you keep percentage), remove the paralysis for supernaturals, and/or possibly raise the blood cost and cooldown timer.  Conflagration really was ridiculously OP, and I would smack it hard with the nerf hammer.

In the pen & paper VTM game Conflagration is the L3 Daimonion power (link), so it'll probably stay at that rank. Back when I did a Baali playthrough (TFN v1.1 I think) it was also the one really good power in the discipline, so I'd caution against nerfing it too much (L2 and L4 were weaker versions of Dominate L1 and L3 from vanilla; L5 requires you to go unarmed and I don't like unarmed). I'm also against making it fixed damage. We've got weapons for that. The percentile damage is what makes Conflagration interesting and unique.

Quote :
While on the subject, is there any reason you didn't make the L1 power permanent?  It seems silly to have a power that costs no blood, require activation.  Nos get x3 blood from rats without having to activate anything... it would make sense for Baali's bonus to work the same way.  The animation for the effect is, without a doubt, friggin GORGEOUS, so I didn't really mind, but thought I'd mention it.  : )

The L1 is not permanent for technical reasons. The Noss rat feeding in vanilla is a passive clan effect, not a discipline effect. Though I guess Zer0 could be sneaky, have Daimonion 1 have no effect and give the feeding bonus directly to the Baali clan. After all, every Baali character is going to have at least 1 rank in the discipline.

But if the Baali still have the XP bonus that is something that should probably be changed. Considering we'll be getting less XP, the bonus is going to be even stronger than before. I think their clan bonus whas changed a bit since I've played one. What is it right now?
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:54 am

@Dragatus wrote:
I'm also against making it fixed damage. We've got weapons for that. The percentile damage is what makes Conflagration interesting and unique.

Unfortunately, that percentage is what made it OP.  I can appreciate having it do percentage damage as a niche effect, to make it different, as you say, from all the weapons.  But I think it needs to be really low, like 5%.  Of course, I don't know what Zero's ultimate goal for the power is... maybe he wants to make it easy for Baali to kill bosses.  I think bosses are supposed to be difficult, which is why I'm assuming Conflagration isn't supposed to make it as easy to kill bosses as I found it.  

But that brings up the issue of how difficult a boss should be.  Should it take one minute to kill?  Five?  Ten?  Half an hour?  I just watched a blind VTMB LP where the gamer complained of spending 45 minutes on Xiao, and they thought that was FAR too long for a boss.  I personally think boss fights aren't "bossy" unless they take a large amount of time. Everyone's different.

In any case, between Invis letting me kill every mortal very easily, and Conflagration letting me kill every boss very easily, I never really needed anything else.  It's partly why I ended up with 65 unused xp (89 if you count that I never once used L5 Doimoinon).  It's hard to analyze myself objectively.  Maybe I'm just a really good player which is why it was so easy for me, but I can't help but think between invis and Conflagration that my char didn't have any real challenges.

Quote :
The L1 is not permanent for technical reasons. The Noss rat feeding in vanilla is a passive clan effect, not a discipline effect. Though I guess Zer0 could be sneaky, have Daimonion 1 have no effect and give the feeding bonus directly to the Baali clan. After all, every Baali character is going to have at least 1 rank in the discipline.

That was my point.  From a gameplay perspective, it's just pointless clicking over and over to use the power, when there's no reason not to use it.  Having it as a passive benefit saves the player pointless repeated mouseclicking.  How does forcing a player to keep clicking their mouse over and over add to the gaming experience?  Instead of seeking out bums to feed off their corrupt souls, I started to avoid them just because I was tired of constantly having to scroll to find my power and activate... too much hassle.  (I also think the extra blood wasn't working some times, but I don't remember).

If it has to remain as an activated power for tech reasons, what about increasing the duration to something like an hour?  This would still require the player to activate it, but they wouldn't have to keep doing it nearly as often.

Of course, I already suggested some time back making L1 powers passive and people poo-pooed the idea.

Quote :
But if the Baali still have the XP bonus that is something that should probably be changed. Considering we'll be getting less XP, the bonus is going to be even stronger than before. I think their clan bonus whas changed a bit since I've played one. What is it right now?
As of 131 the clan bonus was like a saulocept: +1 xp for xp rewards >2.

Just to clarify, I think it was having invis (which is incredibly powerful all by itself) in conjunction with Conflagration that made my game so easy.  I probably shouldn't have cited the xp bonus; it really wasn't a factor in my easy playthrough.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:13 pm

WOW! So many insightful thoughts for me to comment on and sort out. Let me try to tackle this one thought at a time to keep it organized, I don't want to miss anything. And for the record, I REALLY love conversations like these. Many times at TCI, topics get derailed and not much gets accomplished, so when people actually do talk serious about TFN stuff, I get excited! Thanks you two! Smile

Quote :
Ah, okay.  Normally when I watch guys live they're... doing something else.  But I can still enjoy watching a guy play with himself... I mean, by himself.  : P

HAHAHA! This made me crack up!  lol!

Quote :
IMHO, no matter how many lines you had voiced, they would become annoying after a while.  That's just a matter of hearing anything over and over, be it professionally voiced lines from a studio, or amateur voiced from a mod.

I agree with you on hearing the same voice over and over does get tedious, and the first few times you hear it is pretty cool but eventually you just rush past it because you've heard it so many times. Unfortunately there are those in the community who really enjoy the roleplay aspect of it no matter how many times they've heard it, and so keeping professionally spoken lines in there would be important to them, and therefore important to me. I have a personal system for TFN in that if it feels like it was part of the game the whole time, then we did a good job, if it feels like it was added, then shame on us, we implemented it poorly and needs to be redone.

Quote :
Speaking for myself, I'd not only rather have an NPC Seduction option sooner as opposed to waiting for a sufficient number of voiced lines to be made, but even afterwards I'd want the feeding to be silent. Just as when you were toying with the sparkles for the Presence effect in dialog and some gamers didn't like it, I'd prefer silent feeding.  Just my two coppers, FWIW.

This was kind of answered in the paragraph above, but I will add that the Presence visual sparklies can be disabled during dialogue if you approach the NPC in 3rd person or switch to 3rd person while talking to them. If you approach them in 1st person or switch to 1st person while talking to them, you'll see the sparkly graphic. The Presence sound FXs play no matter what however so hopefully it's not too annoying for people who don't like hearing it each time they talk to someone.

When I played my Ishtarri for 1.4 I specialized in Presence, and to be honest with you, I enjoyed hearing the sound FX, seeing the sparklies, and reading the message above the NPC's head each time I spoke with someone. It made me feel so powerful as a player. But then again, I really enjoy the roleplay aspect of Bloodlines and I know not everyone does.

Quote :
In the pen & paper VTM game Conflagration is the L3 Daimonion power (link), so it'll probably stay at that rank.

This doesn't have much of a factor in whether or not Conflagration stays at L3 or not. I've taken many liberties in my implementation of the new disciplines for TFN so I have no problems moving Conflagration if I felt the overall balance would be better. With that said, I need some play time with the Daimoinon discipline (and Baali in general) to get a good sense if the clan is balanced overall. Until I get that playtime experience, I won't be moving any disciplines around, or making any major changes. I have nerfed Conflagration because it was a no brainer to do so, and it was something I was thinking of doing long before Aero posted about it, but after he confirmed my skepticism, I nerfed it immediately for 1.4.

Quote :
The L1 is not permanent for technical reasons. The Noss rat feeding in vanilla is a passive clan effect, not a discipline effect. Though I guess Zer0 could be sneaky, have Daimonion 1 have no effect and give the feeding bonus directly to the Baali clan. After all, every Baali character is going to have at least 1 rank in the discipline.

Not to be Mr. Correcto, but the Noss rat feeding ability and the extra blood from bums ability are both trait effects and can be used as a passive ability, clan trait, or discipline. So from a technical stand point, either of these can used in any scenario. In Camarilla Edition, I used the extra blood from rats trait effect as an Animalism discipline, level 1 I think, which is what gave me the idea for Blood of the Sinner.

As far as clicking on it each and every time you want to feed from a bum or prostitute, this is part of the level 1 discipline and currently lasts for 30 seconds. I apologize if it is annoying to activate but I actually prefer it this way. I want it to be different from the clan merit of bonus experience (though the bonus XP is also a trait effect so if I really wanted too, I could make that a discipline too, lol). I guess I don't want the player to forget why they are getting extra blood from bums and hookers. As a Baali, the blood of the corrupt is more satisfying and Blood of the Sinner and the fact that you have to activate it to get the benefit, gives a greater feel to how evil you are. If it was passive and always on, it really wouldn't feel "evil" anymore. I'm really trying to give the player an "experience" of fulfilling a "role", I don't want Bloodlines (TFN) to turn into an MMO or D&D experience where it's all about the numbers, and has no heart and soul. Just my two cents...

Quote :
I think their clan bonus whas changed a bit since I've played one. What is it right now?

You're right, the Baali clan used to have the bonus XP merit along with +1 to their Intelligence. After getting feedback from the community, I removed the +1 Intelligence making the bonus XP the only merit. I also increased their flaw by making sure dancing wouldn't raise Humanity past 6, but that was more of a bug than a nerf.

I'm sure I missed some questions so let me know if I did and I'll gladly answer them.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Fri Nov 20, 2015 4:41 pm

@Aeroldoth wrote:

In any case, between Invis letting me kill every mortal very easily, and Conflagration letting me kill every boss very easily, I never really needed anything else.  It's partly why I ended up with 65 unused xp (89 if you count that I never once used L5 Doimoinon).  It's hard to analyze myself objectively.  Maybe I'm just a really good player which is why it was so easy for me, but I can't help but think between invis and Conflagration that my char didn't have any real challenges.

I have to admit you raise a valid point, I haven't considered it from that perspective. Having both actually is too good.

@Zer0Morph wrote:
Many times at TCI, topics get derailed and not much gets accomplished, so when people actually do talk serious about TFN stuff, I get excited! Thanks you two! Smile

You're welcome.

Quote :

This doesn't have much of a factor in whether or not Conflagration stays at L3 or not. I've taken many liberties in my implementation of the new disciplines for TFN so I have no problems moving Conflagration if I felt the overall balance would be better. With that said, I need some play time with the Daimoinon discipline (and Baali in general) to get a good sense if the clan is balanced overall. Until I get that playtime experience, I won't be moving any disciplines around, or making any major changes. I have nerfed Conflagration because it was a no brainer to do so, and it was something I was thinking of doing long before Aero posted about it, but after he confirmed my skepticism, I nerfed it immediately for 1.4.

Then play a Baali for your next test. You can still wave around your fancy pimped up Presence and test out Daimonion at the same time.

Quote :
Not to be Mr. Correcto, but the Noss rat feeding ability and the extra blood from bums ability are both trait effects and can be used as a passive ability, clan trait, or discipline.


Smartass. Very Happy I knowthey're trait effects. But the Noss bonus is implemented as a clan trait and the Blood of the Sinner bonus is implemented as an activated discipline.

Quote :
You're right, the Baali clan used to have the bonus XP merit along with +1 to their Intelligence. After getting feedback from the community, I removed the +1 Intelligence making the bonus XP the only merit. I also increased their flaw by making sure dancing wouldn't raise Humanity past 6, but that was more of a bug than a nerf.

Thanks for the info. Well, I thought the XP bonus was too good already in the previous versions and now with reduced overall XP the bonus is becoming even stronger.

I forgot the details of how exactly I did it, but I remember I modded my installation of TFN 1.2 so that the Baali clan trait was that their bloodloss timer was independant from their Humanity and equal to what other clans had at Humanity 5. So a Baali with Humanity 6+ was weaker than another clan/bloodline with the same Humanity. But at Humanity 4 or less the Baali had an easier time than other clans/bloodlines. This made Baali the perfect choice for an evil playthrough.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Sat Nov 21, 2015 3:28 am

@Zer0Morph wrote:
there are those in the community who really enjoy the roleplay aspect of it no matter how many times they've heard it, and so keeping professionally spoken lines in there would be important to them, and therefore important to me.
I understand. I would then request, if possible, to have some way to silence them, or skip the dialog, so that those of us who don't want to hear them don't have to. Just as you made it so some folks can bypass the Presence sparkles, make it so some can bypass the feeding dialog.  Maybe something like:

*talk click on random NPC*

A) "..."
A1) [seduction] "Hey stranger, wanna make out?"
A2) [seduction] "I want you.  Now.  Don't say anything, just kiss me."
A3) "Oops, sorry to bother you."

B1) "Wow, you're sooo attractive!  There's just... something about you. Yes, yes I would like to make out!"
*seduction feed*

B2) *seduction feed*

B3) *end talk*

Quote :
I apologize if it is annoying to activate but I actually prefer it this way.
Oh well. Your mod, your rules. Thanks for explaining.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Sat Nov 21, 2015 3:44 am

@Dragatus wrote:
I modded my installation of TFN 1.2 so that the Baali clan trait was that their bloodloss timer was independant from their Humanity and equal to what other clans had at Humanity 5. So a Baali with Humanity 6+ was weaker than another clan/bloodline with the same Humanity. But at Humanity 4 or less the Baali had an easier time than other clans/bloodlines. This made Baali the perfect choice for an evil playthrough.
That's a neat idea, I like it!

I made up a house rule for my Baali play, a version of diablerie. Whenever I did something that made me "more" of a vampire, more powerful, I would be able to put one dot into one of my disciplines. I wasn't able to raise my disciplines whenever I wanted, but only after "diablerizing" another vamp, and then only by one point per vamp. No matter how much xp I had, I was capped on when I could raise my disciplines. I allowed one point for ghouling Heather, and then extra points were only gained when I defeated another vamp.

This meant I was only able to put a max of two points into disciplines in SM: 1 for Heather, and 1 for foxy boxes. There was two more after the warehouse, and then 3 in downtown for the plaguebearers, and so on.

I thought it was fun because it gave me extra challenge, reflected a sort-of form of diablerie, and was in keeping with the Baali background I thought. There were plenty of times where I had xp just sitting there, and I WANTED to raise my disciplines some more, but I didn't allow myself as I hadn't "earned" that power yet. IIRC, I didn't lose the cap completely until around Hallowbrook.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:43 pm

Your NPC dialogue idea for Seduction is an interesting one to say the least. I was actually going to do something similar but I haven't worked out the details yet. I also wanted to do something with Intimidate where you could rob pedestrians and possibly hookers for their money. This would depend on your Intimidation feat and you would incur a penalty to your Humanity to a certain point. Again I haven't worked out the details on how I want to handle this though.

Your Baali "house" rules sound cool too. The new Baali humanity/bloodloss idea sounds really interesting too, something I may have to look into. That would certainly help with the Baali not getting so much XP, but on the other side it may be a little OP because faster blood loss is a penalty to evil kindred, which the Baali would be immune too.

An idea just sprang up for the Ihstarri clan weakness as well. I'm wondering if changing their weakness to their blood loss timer is faster and so they need blood more often might work as well. Something I'll think about.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 25, 2015 12:37 am

@Zer0Morph wrote:
I also wanted to do something with Intimidate where you could rob pedestrians and possibly hookers for their money. This would depend on your Intimidation feat and you would incur a penalty to your Humanity to a certain point. Again I haven't worked out the details on how I want to handle this though.
Casual response: Only allow each NPC to be robbed once (otherwise you have infinite money), have amount based on threat score (e.g. $10/intimidate point) so there's value to a high score, no humanity loss. IMO, it's better to have a lot of minor rewards, thereby making the skill seem very useful and pleasing the player by letting them use it multiple times, than to give few, large amounts that can invalidate other money skills, like haggle or even locks. Since other skills don't have penalties attached and int has never been useful, I don't think it should carry a humanity loss now. Keep the rewards small, but allow a lot of them. Doing this should trigger a criminal violation.

Certain classes should be immune: supernaturals, cops, security, gangers (peeps with weapons), hookers, bums.

Quote :
faster blood loss
I wish there was a setting to control speed of blood loss, as I'd like it much faster than it already is. I like mods that make games harder, and IMO the bloodloss timer is still way too easy. Don't get me wrong, I love that it exists at all, a solid improvement over the zero bloodloss of vanilla. I know some gamers like it off entirely, but a setting would let everyone choose their own speed. Not what you were talking about, just wanted to toss that in there.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:59 am

@Zer0Morph wrote:
The new Baali humanity/bloodloss idea sounds really interesting too, something I may have to look into. That would certainly help with the Baali not getting so much XP, but on the other side it may be a little OP because faster blood loss is a penalty to evil kindred, which the Baali would be immune too.

That's the point. They get penalized less for being evil and rewarded less for being good. That would encourage them to actually be evil, more than a hard cap on Humanity.

Quote :
An idea just sprang up for the Ihstarri clan weakness as well. I'm wondering if changing their weakness to their blood loss timer is faster and so they need blood more often might work as well. Something I'll think about.

I like it.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:52 pm

I like your idea on giving smaller rewards more frequently so the player feels like they're actually using the ability. Good call!

@Aeroldoth wrote:
I wish there was a setting to control speed of blood loss, as I'd like it much faster than it already is.  I like mods that make games harder, and IMO the bloodloss timer is still way too easy.  Don't get me wrong, I love that it exists at all, a solid improvement over the zero bloodloss of vanilla.  I know some gamers like it off entirely, but a setting would let everyone choose their own speed.  Not what you were talking about, just wanted to toss that in there.

You can adjust the blood timer manually to be whatever speed you want. Here's the link on how to do it and what files you need to change. Consider this method in replace of a graphical slider, because I'm not sure how to do that for Bloodlines, otherwise I'd put it in. I agree it should be adjustable.

http://camarillaedition.darkbb.com/t2141-how-to-change-or-turn-off-the-blood-timer

Draggy wrote:
That's the point. They get penalized less for being evil and rewarded less for being good. That would encourage them to actually be evil, more than a hard cap on Humanity.

I see what you're saying and it makes sense, the only problem is that right now, when you choose to do evil things, you get XP for it, so being bad essentially makes you more powerful. The "low humanity = faster bloodloss" is the penalty for being bad. If we remove that for Baali, then we go right back to them being bad and not getting penalized for it. I guess all in all, it's the same thing we have now just done in a different way, through the extra XP bonus.
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PostSubject: Re: Interview with Zer0Morph about the upcoming TFN 1.4 patch    Today at 12:30 pm

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