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 Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"

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Voraxith
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Mon Mar 26, 2012 7:59 pm

Bloodcookies? Labradors? Hmm, seems like home. Yup-yup. Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Sat Apr 07, 2012 5:56 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Sat Apr 07, 2012 6:20 pm

Lmfao, awesome Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Sat Apr 07, 2012 7:37 pm

For the record, that was just awesome. Makes me miss Skyrim even more. Sad
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Tue May 22, 2012 2:26 am



It's official: real vampires have landed in Skyrim. Check out the mod page -- link in the video description. Twisted Evil
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Tue May 22, 2012 6:33 am

Well that's just fucking awesome. Finally a mage character might be worth doing
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed May 23, 2012 1:21 am

Meh. I played around with it a bit. They got some things right, but they got some things glaringly wrong. For instance, you are automatically given a potion in your inventory to "awaken your vampiric powers", which quite a few have nothing to do with vampirism, but necromancy. That, and you still can't "breathe" underwater, like damned kindred should! Maybe we should make a vampire overhaul for Skyrim? Any takers with me?
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed May 23, 2012 8:00 am

Do you mean a generic vampire overhaul or a specificly Vampire overhaul?
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Wed May 23, 2012 1:22 pm

I mean specifically a VtM overhaul. I know a lot of the core elements wouldn't translate well, but by Talos and Caine, I think we could make the Volkihar a tad bit more like proper Kindred! Maybe even find a way to introduce clans of some sort... And definitely tweak the vampiric powers to be more like Disciplines.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 3:51 am

WTF?!?!?!

Seriously, read this entire thread. You will literally shit your pants with how stupid some people can truly be. And for those of you who are offended, I ask: what the hell are you doing here?!

_____
EDIT:
This just might have to be my new favorite pic.
Spoiler:
 
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 8:09 am

Voraxith wrote:
WTF?!?!?!

Seriously, read this entire thread. You will literally shit your pants with how stupid some people can truly be. And for those of you who are offended, I ask: what the hell are you doing here?!

_____
EDIT:
This just might have to be my new favorite pic.
Spoiler:
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landover_Baptist_Church
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 10:01 am

I was reading the same garbage about Dungeons and Dragons 30 years ago. The world hasn't ended, there are still no verified reports of D&D turning kids into satan worshippers (although a few with pre-existing mental conditions have done wacky things); and D&D is still going strong, having spawned many similar games.

In fact, gaming has helped many young men and boys in the quest to keep their virginity indefinitely, which most churches seem to favor. So one would think the churches would support the gaming culture. Smile

Just my opinion...
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 11:25 am

Voraxith wrote:
WTF?!?!?!

Seriously, read this entire thread. You will literally shit your pants with how stupid some people can truly be. And for those of you who are offended, I ask: what the hell are you doing here?!

_____
EDIT:
This just might have to be my new favorite pic.
Spoiler:
 

I didn't read itall, but what I did made me laugh. Very Happy


Voraxith wrote:
I mean specifically a VtM overhaul. I know a lot of the core elements wouldn't translate well, but by Talos and Caine, I think we could make the Volkihar a tad bit more like proper Kindred! Maybe even find a way to introduce clans of some sort... And definitely tweak the vampiric powers to be more like Disciplines.

I'm currently busy making a general Skyrim overhaul, but after I'm done with that I could help you with this. I'm actually already getting ideas.

The most important thing we need to decide at this point is how much of the original game do we want to preserve. The simplest would be to go for a fusion. We leave Tamriel as it is, then just throw in the VtM clans as they are.

We could make the player start out as a vampire (and change the intro so it happens during the night) and have each vampiric race represent a different clan. For example Imperial vampires could be Ventrue and Altmer vampires could be Tremere.

We could toy with changing magicka into blood.

An alternative to a direct fusion would be to take known vampire bloodlines from Tamrielic lore and have them represent specific VtM clans.

Daggerfall had 9 clans, Morrowind had 3 clans, Cyrodil had a single unnamed clan, and the book Immortal Blood mentions the Volkihar of Sykrim and 4 clans from Valenwood. Alltogether that's 18 clans. If we go with my race-clan pair idea we'll only need 10 clans so that should be plenty.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 11:50 am

ThePhilosopher wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landover_Baptist_Church

Oh, thank Satan. I hoped it was a joke. Whew. Rolling Eyes
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 12:08 pm

Dragatus wrote:
Spoiler:
 

Wow, very ambitious. What I was thinking, though, was actually more like creating a few factions in the game for a few of the clans, each with fully voiced NPCs, representing one of the most distinctive clans of the game -- perhaps even taking from Requiem instead of Masquerade. And those clans were at war with each other, but a quiet and duplicitous war.

I like your idea for the races. Here's just a thought:
Altmer - Tremere
Argonian - Setite
Bosmer - ?
Breton - Malkavian
Dunmer - ?
Imperial - Ventrue
Khajiit - Gangrel
Nord - ?
Orsimer - Brujah
Redguard - Assamite

I can't think of anyone for Wood Elves (maybe Ravnos?), Dark Elves (maybe Lasombra?), or Nords (maybe Caitiff?).
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 12:10 pm

Sounds cool to me, as long as the mod would be well done I think this can be pulled off nicely.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 12:17 pm

Obviously, compromises would have to be made. My original idea for a Vampire overhaul was quite different. The base vampiric state would be modified to more closely match VtM, but the Disciplines would be taught as spells via either Books or NPC trainers.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 12:18 pm

I'm still fine with this, would prefer Masquerade over Requiem though.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 2:44 pm

Voraxith wrote:

Wow, very ambitious. What I was thinking, though, was actually more like creating a few factions in the game for a few of the clans, each with fully voiced NPCs, representing one of the most distinctive clans of the game -- perhaps even taking from Requiem instead of Masquerade. And those clans were at war with each other, but a quiet and duplicitous war.

I don't think any of my ideas was aprticulalry ambitious. Changing the time of day at the start of the game would probably only require fiddling with a few settings. Making the player start as a vampire only requires us to make the vampire races playable and the non-vampire races unplayable. It's literally as simple as clicking the proper checkbox and could be done in a couple of minutes.

As for matching VtM clans with Tamrielic clans, it's just a matter of looking at the disciplines of the former and matching them with the special abilities of the later. It shouldn't be much more difficult than matching VtM clans with TES races.

I'm not familiar with Requiem at all so I would prefer to keep it Masquerade based.

Quote :
I like your idea for the races. Here's just a thought:
Altmer - Tremere
Argonian - Setite
Bosmer - ?
Breton - Malkavian
Dunmer - ?
Imperial - Ventrue
Khajiit - Gangrel
Nord - ?
Orsimer - Brujah
Redguard - Assamite

I can't think of anyone for Wood Elves (maybe Ravnos?), Dark Elves (maybe Lasombra?), or Nords (maybe Caitiff?).

I would make Bretons Toreador rather than Malkavians. They are not know for being crazy but they are sort of known for court intrigue. In TES2: Daggerfall the main quest mainly revolved around figuring out who murdered the king and why. And if you pick Breton during skyrim's character creation Hadvar will ask you: "You from Daggerfall, Breton? Fleeing from some court intrigue?"

I'd say Bosmer should be Gangrel. They have a thing for animals and Immortal Blood mentions a clan from Valenwood that can turn into mist. Plus there is the whole Wild Hunt thing.

Quote :
Wild Hunt is a magical trait innate to all Bosmer. It is brought on by a collective ritual performed by many Bosmer, causing them to shapeshift into a horde of feral, supernatural beasts.

Khajiit could be Ravnos. It's a bit of a stretch, but all the Khajiits NPCs in Skyrim are traveling merchants. Or they could be Malkavian. They have their Moonsugar and they develop into one of 16 (IIRC) distinct subraces based on the position of the moons at the time of their birth. If that isn't lunatic, I don't know what is. Wink

Dunmer could be Cappadocian/Giovanni. They used to summon ghost to protect their ancestral tombs and they used the bones of their dead to construct the Ghostfence from TES3: Morrowind. Lasombra wouldn't be entirely unfitting either considering that before the days of the Tribunal temple they worshiped Boethia (Daedric prince of plots) and Mephala (Daedric prince of murder). And their Tribunal Temple religion had some Catholic vibes with the holy trinity and the small army of saints.

Nords could perhaps be Salubri warrior caste. They hate Altmer, who are Tremere and the warriors are fairly kick-ass. Or perhaps we could make Nords Brujah and Orcs would then be Salubri. Going by clan disciplines that would actually be a better fit. I have a hard time imagining Orcs with Presence, but Fortitude would fit them very well. The Orcs of Skyrim are also outsiders, seperated from general society and with their own set of laws.

So my adjusted list is this:
Altmer - Tremere
Argonian - Setite
Bosmer - Gangrel
Breton - Toreador
Dunmer - Cappadocian, Giovanni or Lasombra
Imperial - Ventrue
Khajiit - Malkavian or Ravnos
Nord - Brujah
Orsimer - Salubri (Warrior Caste)
Redguard - Assamite
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 7:25 pm

Voraxith wrote:

I like your idea for the races. Here's just a thought:
Altmer - Tremere
Argonian - Setite
Bosmer - ?
Breton - Malkavian
Dunmer - ?
Imperial - Ventrue
Khajiit - Gangrel
Nord - ?
Orsimer - Brujah
Redguard - Assamite

I can't think of anyone for Wood Elves (maybe Ravnos?), Dark Elves (maybe Lasombra?), or Nords (maybe Caitiff?).

Where are the Tzimisce?
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Thu May 24, 2012 7:33 pm

ThePhilosopher wrote:
Where are the Tzimisce?

If you wanna figure out a way to make Viccissitude in Skyrim, then be my guest. Razz

Oh, and the reason I proposed using the clans from Requiem is because instead of the very niched concepts like they are in Masquerade, the five clans in Requiem match up with very general vampire tropes. Gangrel = ultimate animalistic predators, Ventrue = high and mighty power brokers, Daeva = suave and sophisticated seducers, Mekhet = shadowy creeps in the shadows, and Nosferatu = just plain good ol' fashion ugly monsters that eat the fuck outta you.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Fri May 25, 2012 2:42 am

Voraxith wrote:
ThePhilosopher wrote:
Where are the Tzimisce?

If you wanna figure out a way to make Viccissitude in Skyrim, then be my guest. Razz

Exactly. Of all the disciplines Viccissitude is the hardest to recreate in Skyrim. Obtenebration could also be challenging (shadow tentacles) so I'm leaning towards Cappadocian or Giovanni for the Dunmer.

Quote :
Oh, and the reason I proposed using the clans from Requiem is because instead of the very niched concepts like they are in Masquerade, the five clans in Requiem match up with very general vampire tropes. Gangrel = ultimate animalistic predators, Ventrue = high and mighty power brokers, Daeva = suave and sophisticated seducers, Mekhet = shadowy creeps in the shadows, and Nosferatu = just plain good ol' fashion ugly monsters that eat the fuck outta you.

Interesting. It's a possibility, we'd just have to asign two races to each clan and figure out what to do with the Nossies (because even Orcs are too pretty to be Nosferatu).

How about a little vote on the matter? Who all would prefer Masquerade clans and who likes Requiem clans better? Yes, I know the people on this forum will probably be biased towards VtM, but it's the principle of the thing.

I'm essentially neutral, but in case of a tie I'd go with VtM simply because I am morer familiar with them.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Fri May 25, 2012 2:56 am

By the by, I have been playing around a bit with the CK, and I have a fairly active account over at the Skyrim Nexus (fuck Steam). Any of you wanna, hit me up over there. I am Voraxith!
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Fri May 25, 2012 8:38 am

I've been thinking and here are the things that I belive we can do. (In concept at least. Practical implementation of many will still require figuring things out.)

We can implement blood points by extending the 4 stages of vampirism into 11 stages. The first stage would represent having 10 blood points, the second would represent having 9, the third would represent having 8 and so forth with the 11th stage representing 0 blood points. Disciplines that use blood points would simply advance you to the next stage of vampirism and the final stage would prevent you from using such powers.

We could fiddle around with feeding mechanics. That vampire mod seemed to do it pretty well (at least in concept) and we should copy them.

We can implement Humanity, but frenzy is at best very difficult and at worst impossible. What we could do however is to give the player some sort of penalty that only ends when you feed on someone. It is also trivial to make everybody nearby attack the player.

We can implement gaining vampire experience and using it to upgrade your disciplines. I think the best way to do it would be to give the player 1 experience for each blood points they get through feeding (so if you are full you're not gaining any exp). We should probably also limit exp gain to something like 10 per day in order to prevent grinding. I'd give players the first rank in all 3 clan disciplines for free and then improving a discipline from 1 to 2 would cost 100 experience, from 2 to 3 would cost 200, from 3 to 4 would cost 300, and from 4 to 5 would cost 400. We could also make it possible for players to improve their Humanity by 1 for 100 vampire exp.

Sun damage should be easy to implement.

Assuming we go with VtM clans, here's my latest take on clans and disciplines:
Argonian - Followers of Set (Obfuscate, Presence, Serpentis)
Altmer - Tremere (Auspex, Dominate, Thaumaturgy)
Bosmer - Gangrel (Animalism, Fortitude, Protean)
Breton - Toreador (Ausepx, Celerity, Presence)
Dunmer - Giovanni (Dominate, Necromancy, Potence)
Imperial - Ventrue (Dominate, Fortitude, Presence)
Khajiit - Malkavian (Auspex, Dementation, Obfuscate)
Nord - Brujah (Celerity, Potence, Presence)
Orc - Caitiff (Celerity, Fortitude, Potence)
Redguard - Assamite (Celerity, Obfuscate, Quietus)


Animalism

Rank 1: Telepathically speaking to animals is out, but it should be possible to make some sort of Nightwisp Ravens effect. It would essentially be a Calm or Paralyze spell with perhaps bats flying around the target. Not sure how exactly to do it, but I think it's possible.
Rank 2: Beckoning is super easy, just summon a wolf.
Rank 3: Song of Serenity and Spectral Wolf are both very simple to implement.
Rank 4: This one's tricky to do by the p&p rules, but we could change possessing an animal into controling an animal as per the Bosmer racial special.
Rank 5: We could represent Drawing out the Beast with a powerful Frenzy spell. However, this makes it intrude in Dementation's teritory. Maybe instead we could make a permanent Command animal spell instead.


Auspex

Easiest to represent with a Detect Life spell. Maybe throw in the Clairvoyance effect. We can use the effect of the Become Ethereal shout for rank 5 (astral projection).


Celerity

There is a "slow time" shout so this should be easy enough to implement. It could slow time down by a factor of (1 + rank) for a duration of (1 + rank)*2 seconds. That gives slowed by a factor of 2 for 4 seconds at rank 1 and slowed by 6 for 12 seconds at rank 5.


Dementation

Rank 1: Somewhat tricky. Easiest would be to model Passions with a Frenzy spell.
Rank 2: The Haunting could be a stronger Frenzy spell.
Rank 3: Vision of death could be a scripted effect that instantly kills low level enemies.
Rank 4: Berserk could be a Frenzy spell that kills the target when the effect ends.
Rank 5: We can make Bedlam as an area of effect Frenzy spell.


Dominate

I think the best way to handle this one would be to make an Command spell that gets stronger with each rank.


Fortitude

Reduce damage by 10% per rank. Can easily be done with perks.


Necromancy

Depending on which path we choose we can either give the player increasingly strong Raise Dead spells or give them the ability to summon increasignly powerful ghosts.


Obfuscate

We can just use the Invisibilty effect with various condition based on rank.


Potence

It would be simple to give the player 20% extra damage per rank.


Presence

It would be easy to give the player a cloak spell that reduces the damage output of everybody nearby. We can also try to model Awe with a Persuasion bonus and Dread Gaze with a Fear spell and Intimidation bonus. We can also include some sort of Fortify Barter effect.


Protean

Rank 1: I think all vampires should have Night Eye so I'm not sure what to do with this. One thought is to make it cost blood for other clans (1 blood point per night) and be free for the Gangrel.
Rank 2: Unarmed bonus. Very simple to do.
Rank 3: Earth Meld can be a spell that teleports you to a special "underground" location where you can wait and when you cast it again it returns you to your original location. I've done something similair with my teleportation mod so it's 100% doable.
Rank 4: There is a change race command so polymorphing into animals is possible. However, better Unarmed bonus might be preferable.
Rank 5: From what I read in the description, that vampire mod you linked had some sort of mist form. Maybe we can copy it.


Quietus

Rank 1: Muffle or Fortify Sneak, both are very simple.
Rank 2: A spell that adds poison to your inventory. The poison's effect is to increase all incoming damage that the target suffers.
Rank 3: Dagon's call is tricky to do by p&p rules, but we could make a spell that kills a target that is below a certain threshold value of health.
Rank 4: A spell that adds a strong damaging poison to your inventory.
Rank 5: We could use the spitting attack of the Afflicted from Peryite's daedric quest as a basis for Taste of Death.

Serpentis

Rank 1: Eye of the Serpent is a simpley Paralyze spell.
Rank 2: Tongue of the Asp is difficult. Perhaps we could make the Eye of the Serpent stronger instead.
Rank 3: Skin of the Adder is simple enough. We could easily Fortify Armor Rating or use a perk that reduces damage by 20%.
Rank 4: If someone makes a cobra form race for us this should be possible. Othererwise it won't go. We could however simply make Skin of the Adder stronger.
Rank 5: Heart of Darkness is easy to implementm, but since nobody in Skyrim wants to stake you we need to find another use for it. We could do what Zer0morph did and make it prevent bloodloss while disabling the use of other disciplines.


Thaumaturgy

It would probably be best to just use Path of Blood.

Rank 1: Bloodstrike can be a simple projectile spell similair to Firebolt, except it would Absorb Health instead of causing Fire Damage.
Rank 2: Purge can be a cloak spell that does damage. The vomiting is probably possible to do using the previosuly mentioned spitting atatck of the Afflicted (we'll just have to find a way to recolor the spit from green to red).
Rank 3: Blood Shield would be a Fortify Health spell.
Rank 4: Theft of Vitae shouldn't be too hard.
Rank 5: I have no idea how to implement Blood Boil. Cauldron of Blood however, should be simple enough.
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PostSubject: Re: Just for ThePhilospher... "Sweet!"   Fri May 25, 2012 9:01 am

instakill = absorb health [amount] and then just throw there the max amount of health of generic creature which will be met by player on current level. I worked with a guy on such spell mechanics, though he made it for Oblivion.
Bethesda's works usually don't love scripted effects, and if a body killed by script will be lying around when you try to save - whooops crash is here.

I don't know if Skyrim is similar to Oblivion, but if it is, then animations for Blood Boil could be taken from modification "Deadly Combat", which in some situations allowed a player who casted a firebolt to burn target alive. Yep, it falls on knees and turns in a burning corpse, then falls to ground and turns into a guy who smokes from all places he could =)

As I recall, Cauldron of Blood maybe done by connecting Firebolt and aoe Fire Damage, which results in BOOM and splashes =) needs testing though
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