Cease and Desist to Antitribu (Marvin) (Locked)

Okay, seriously, I'm a bit wtf'd about all of this.

I'll give you'alls my thoughts on this later on. In the meantime, I'll just post memes.
(just a note that we're fighting on IP that none of us owns. CCP's being a bitch about it and those are the bad guys)

Childe of Malkav wrote:

I didn't look on his site, because I still believe Antitribu will never be released.
But if it's right that he had set a release date, and moved it after Zer0 annonced the date for TFN, then he is the biggest motherfucker I hope never to see.

Seems we got the legends about Gehenna wrong. The ancients will rise, but they don't devour the whole world, only the part of it called Marvin.

Yes, he had a release date set then moved it back to the 5th after he heard of our release date. He was asked not to do that but did it anyways and spouted off some garbage about me. What's frustrating is that TCI and Antitribu have been at peace for the last couple years, then out of nowhere he pulls this shit. He did it on purpose to cause problems, and problems are what he got. This release date problem then caused me to do some research on Marvin which is how I found out everything else, which I then blew up on.

Yes, I agree Malkav, he is the biggest motherfucker I hope to never see.

Jad.3 wrote:

He knows what he's doing. Public relations man! As commies used to say, you need to think politically! Cool off before you answer. No calling him names. Use that american way of yours I find so annoying. Stop the aggression, turn tables, play on emotions. Beat him at his game. Don't uderestime him and the power of lies.

I don't do politics dude. Politics are for pussies and cowards, I'm not playing his game nor will I stoop to his level. I don't live in the shadows like he does. Stop the aggression, stop being 'American'? Dude are you for real?

I just received another email from Marvin just now. He's finally admitting to using our Serpentis icon but says "He didn't know", LOL. Then he proceeded to spout off about 5 paragraphs of more lies, like he gave us the Antitribu mod 3 years ago and we revere engineered it to create TFN. I'm done with this kid, he doesn't have an honest bone in his body.

I won't even bother filling up his garbage on this site anymore, and making the community aware of him doesn't really change anything. He's going to continue being a snake and I'll continue modding TFN for the community, so there's not much more to say.

If you can, with the internet problems you're having and all, I would suggest this email being the final one posted since it would be a nice wrap-up even for those skeptic folk out there and make that the conclusion on this little drama. That and I'm curious; privacy is irrelevant, reveal to me your secrets.

Well Karavolos, I wasn't planning on releasing his last email until he sent me this latest one, which I'm proud to display for all to see. He's finally losing his cool which is nice to see. Finally some emotion instead of the cold snake-like responses we've gotten so far.

So in his second to last email he says that he honestly didn't know they were using my Serpentis icon. He finally admitted to using it, but says he didn't know, LOL. Whatever liar. Then he says he gave us Antitribu 3 years ago to be nice and we reverse engineered it to create TFN, HAHAHAHA! There's nothing this kid won't say, will he?

Enjoy reading the conclusion to this garbage. I won't be responding to him anymore, he's not even a human being, you need to have a conscience to be considered human.

Jad.3 wrote:

Use that american way of yours

Zer0Morph wrote:

stop being 'American'?

Anyway, he admitted he's not doing all the work and degraded work of "his" people. I'd ask for proof of his claims. I'd try to reach out to people he mentioned. If I was concerned enough

Hi, it's me again. The newbie. The one that asks foolish questions, with a philosophy of "he who asks is dumb for 5 minutes, he who asks not is eternally dumb".

I REALLY did register just to ask if you were mad at someone stealing a single icon. You see, I, as a game developer, must find resources (as in icons, models, textures, codes, templates...), understand how "not knowing it was yours" means. Somebody could've given it to him. Like, "hey, check this cool icon for your serpentis!" and then use it.

The effect on the target of Eye of the Snake (Trance) is from Razer(tm), so we can't go "you can't steal stuff!!!" on anyone here

But let's say I don't believe him, because I don't, since there is nowhere to find this exact resource (is there?). I ask: What is the problem (again, in case I didn't read, or in case I did but forgot) of him pushing his release date so close to yours? We can beat the game in two days, heck, less. And then compare both games/mods to see which one is better.

[Please notice I write in paragraphs, it means, you should reply in topics, and not everything at once '-']

Is the problem that both mods are too alike, because he's copying your mod? Or because he's copying it, he's ahead of you in content?

Quote :

Anyway, he admitted he's not doing all the work and degraded work of "his" people. I'd ask for proof of his claims. I'd try to reach out to people he mentioned. If I was concerned enough Rolling Eyes

Actually Jad, I've honestly grown tired of Marvin and I simply don't care anymore. I'm thinking so far down the road now that I just don't have the mental capacity to keep at him. I've said what I wanted to say and I've shown the community that he's scum and why, so anymore from me would be beating a dead horse. The evidence is there and people will either agree or disagree with me, it's not my call.

Cretino,

These are great questions, fair and honest, so I'll answer them. I agree with you, using the Razer Logo for TFN's Serpentis which *IS* a trademarked logo, is stealing from Razer, no question there. The problem isn't theft, the problem isn't a silly little icon, the problem is Marvin, who he is as a person and how he conducts his business. He's been like this little puppy nipping at the heals of the bigger dogs for years dying to be thought of as a respected modder. The problem is that he doesn't want to spend the time learning how to mod like the rest of us have, the long tireless nights at home alone trying and failing time and time again, he wants the glory and respect handed to him without putting in the work, so he lies, wheels and deals, and backstands at every turn to get what he wants with the smallest amount of effort possible. That's the problem, that's what all of this has been about.

If this was about a silly icon being used I wouldn't had said anything, but with Marvin, it's never as simple as a silly icon or moved release date.

Why do you even bother then? He sent you a mean email, he "stole" something you said it's silly ...he just wants fame (at the expense of others, thought).

What is bothering me the most is, if he can't mod well, and has a team, but has the skills of propaganda, why don't he leave modding and help everybody by promoting you (plural)?


P.S.: I want to beta test TFN 1.3, can't wait to play it any longer

Quote :

Why do you even bother then? He sent you a mean email, he "stole" something you said it's silly ...he just wants fame (at the expense of others, thought).

Because it made me mad, at first. I've let everyone know, the community is aware of who they're dealing with so I've cooled down and moved on. I really don't care anymore.

Quote :

What is bothering me the most is, if he can't mod well, and has a team, but has the skills of propaganda, why don't he leave modding and help everybody by promoting you (plural)?

And I'll be honest with you, if he were a person of integrity and honor, I would ask him to join TCI and do nothing but moderate the website and put him in charge of screenshots, promotions, etc.... Unfortunately we can't trust him to stay honest and uphold the TCI standard of integrity. Nobody on the TCI team would even think about doing the kinds of things he's done and is doing.

Quote :

I want to beta test TFN 1.3, can't wait to play it any longer

I'd love to appease your enthusiasm but I promise, Feb. 7th will be worth the wait.

Zer0Morph wrote:

I'd love to appease your enthusiasm but I promise, Feb. 7th will be worth the wait.

Will you make hot fixes, like 1.3.1, 1.3a or stuff like that? I'm 100% sure that you will have something to fix, something that didn't come like you wanted, or like people expected to be. Because it will be painful to wait for the 1.4 version if you don't make patches in between.

Cretino wrote:

Will you make hot fixes, like 1.3.1, 1.3a or stuff like that? I'm 100% sure that you will have something to fix, something that didn't come like you wanted, or like people expected to be. Because it will be painful to wait for the 1.4 version if you don't make patches in between.

Good call! I don't plan on waiting as long to release 1.4 as I have in the past, you're right, I've let too much time go by between releases. I'd like to start releasing smaller patches more frequently. Instead of waiting 1 year for a huge patch, releasing 1 smaller one every 6 months or so.

If something is game breaking, like not being able to finish the game with Ming Xiao's ending, that would definitely require a hot-fix which I'd be happy to fix between major releases. If it's something minor like a ring missing from the floor or a beer can sticking out of the ceiling, that can wait.

Zer0Morph wrote:

If something is game breaking, like not being able to finish the game with Ming Xiao's ending, that would definitely require a hot-fix which I'd be happy to fix between major releases. If it's something minor like a ring missing from the floor or a beer can sticking out of the ceiling, that can wait.

Or like entering the room and the television is not playing, even though it's on (the subtitles not playing as well)... walking on the walls make you faster, bunny hopping as well... oh then the part where you can trigger the conversation from beneath Theresse (when she's pissed about you destroying the gallery pictures, the whole floor is a trigger)... so many that can wait.


Edit: sorry, there's this annoying one, when I do alt+tab and go back to the game, my character is walking non-stop. I know it's something implemented. I just wish a key combination didn't trigger the Auto Walk/Run.

Cretino wrote:

Or like entering the room and the television is not playing, even though it's on (the subtitles not playing as well)... walking on the walls make you faster, bunny hopping as well... oh then the part where you can trigger the conversation from beneath Theresse (when she's pissed about you destroying the gallery pictures, the whole floor is a trigger)... so many that can wait.


Edit: sorry, there's this annoying one, when I do alt+tab and go back to the game, my character is walking non-stop. I know it's something implemented. I just wish a key combination didn't trigger the Auto Walk/Run.

Walking on walls? Bunny hopping? Triggering a conversation beneath Theresse? Does this happen to you?

You can remove ALT and Shift from being hard-coded, just open autoexec.cfg located in \Vampire\cfg\ and take out these lines.

alias run "-speed;bind SHIFT walk"
alias walk "+speed;bind SHIFT run"
bind SHIFT walk
alias go "+forward;bind ALT stop"
alias stop "-forward;bind ALT go"
bind ALT go

Ok sorry, the first two I was messing with you. Both are source engine errors. Since it's and old version, old bugs are within the game. I feel like playing Counter Strike alright. You will only fix it if you port the whooole game to another engine, which I believe you won't do anytime in the future, since this is just a mod.

Now, the Theresse bug, well, that floor is almost penetrable from beneath! So when you stick your head from the table (near the blood doll, asylum second level, the strange girl, get where I am saying?), it triggers.


Ok, check this out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtsEzsVtY6k
It's a speedrun.

Most of what's done there can be done on your mod (I wonder about late game, if there big changes, oh well).

I'm watching it now, I had no idea you could jump over the trigger at the beach house, haha, nice! I also didn't realize you could trigger Therese through the floor.

Another funny bug is that you can see behind the Diner by jump crouching and you can see they are 2 dimensional boxes, lol.

I don't know if it is really necessary to do something about this Terese trigger. But fixing it should be easy. Move the activator from logic_auto to the upper elevator doors, and set a disable sequence to the lower doors.

Which trigger at the Beachhouse are you talking about? (Sorry, I don't want to spend an hour watching someone else playing bloodlines. The time is better spent making a testrun for my own mod.)

Childe of Malkav wrote:

I don't know if it is really necessary to do something about this Terese trigger. But fixing it should be easy. Move the activator from logic_auto to the upper elevator doors, and set a disable sequence to the lower doors.

Which trigger at the Beachhouse are you talking about? (Sorry, I don't want to spend an hour watching someone else playing bloodlines. The time is better spent making a testrun for my own mod.)

It's very early in the run. Like, 10 minutes.
It's the trigger that breaks the ground on the staircase of th beach house. By jumping, you still reach the second floor, therefore skipping half of the house.

Topic closed?

I didn't find a Presentation thread so I'm posting here. Hello everyone, I'm Malachite; or Mal for short.
I came here due to my curious nature. I was originally on the Antitribu forums, I don't hide that fact. I even use the same name and avatar here. I'm an upfront person despite being a Nosferatu.

My first and foremost concern is Bloodlines because that game is like religion to me. Completing it at least two or three times per year is like a rite.

I don't like to take sides, I just want to have some fun while playing Bloodlines. Sometimes the ride is with the vanilla version, patched of course, and sometime is with a mod.

I do want to seek truth, and to know all sides of a conflict, before forming an opinion.

I had played both The Final Nights and Clan Quest Mod and I enjoyed them for the most part. There's stuff I loved like the bookdealer Assamite NPC, it looked very professional, and stuff that, honestly, I didn't like at all, for instance: the bloodloss, which is sadly (to me, of course) like gospel to all the Bloodlines mods it seems. But as they say One man's meat is another's poison.

So, just saying "hi", congatulate you for the good work. It's sad to see, as the player I am, that the modding community is divided.

Malachite wrote:

My first and foremost concern is Bloodlines because that game is like religion to me.

Bloodlines fhtagn I'a

Ohai

Bloodloss is a feature important to emulate pen and paper, but also to press the issue and the need to hunt and feed regularly. Anything using CE is using it, because CE started with Bloodloss. That was Zer0's mod to begin with, right?
Now it will be able to be non-running during dialog scenes (which was the main complain of it AFAIK).


Bloodlines modding was always divided ; I know of UP, CE, CQM, TFN, and since.. well, since almost its beginning. Wesp (UP) has a very regular schedule and he's been at it for years (way too fast imho ; he tends to add bugs on the go, fix it, but his fixes add other bugs, and then it becomes very hard for everyone else to merge a clean UP version into their mod) ; UP+ is now just a mod for which Wesp integrated "his vision" of the game, and is not a patch anymore, again, still IMHO. Zer0 then Malkav (CE) integrated Bloodloss and then a few elements that kept VTMB close to the elements of Pen and Paper ; most side features are to enhance existing values. The biggest "core" change to me was the balancing of disciplines and the exchange of book versus online campus. Money's become more important. For TFN, Zer0 wanted to give VTMB a whole new flavor, with clans who have compatible disciplines (engine limits) ; he made the game upon an earlier version of UP (while Malkav kept up with relevant UP updates) and fixed the bugs on his own. He's really hyped, but by periods (like, LETS DO THIS!! and release something in a few months, and then get bored/taken by life and do something else right bro?). To me TFN is more.. "epic". The core mechanics (humanity/masquerade) are very much changed.
Burgermeister (CQM) is probably the guy I have the most affinity with because our vision of the WoD is pretty similar (that's because I taught him everything lol XD but we're close friends too). Until recently he tried to integrate the best of everything with everyone's approval, but merging is a paaaaaain in the ass and now he's in some sort of a block. He basically follows the same ideals as Malkav for his own content (couple of npcs, quests), but he doesn't add the difficulty by adding such features. To me, Burger adds a "game experience" ; the quests for each clan, the shortcut through the warrens... he adds to the game instead of "modifying it". Of course if you play it with CE, you'll have CE's features.


For me, Antitribu was the loch ness. I still have more faith in it than in the WoD MMO by CCP. I think it globally follows Zer0's idea of the game (epicness) as well as features such as that library in UP+, but for the rest, I still think Antitribu misbehaved towards the community ;

CE, TFN and UP, as well as CQM, have always made available all their features for everyone to use so long as credit was given. Burger and Wesp communicate quite often about whatever problem. When Burger and Zer0 talked about a technical issue Zer0 had, Zer0 fully said "aweome BM01 is awesome".
My view is that Antitribu wants everyone to be open source, but they've not given it back to everyone, keeping it to themselves. Especially about skins (and Lenuska-ghost). Everyone has an ego and some fanbase they'd like to be recognized from (apart from Malkav, but he be crazy, so he no counts ). And that's really legit, I mean everyone puts hard work into their stuff, it's normal that they'd feel hurt when they read Antitribu did stuff they didn't, of that they try and compare (TFN is playing a chunk of Antitribu, I don't agree).
This attitude is what broke the gentlemen's agreement as far as my french eyes can see. Now everyone's got their ego and their love for the game on the line, and well, backing off isn't really an easy option.


That said, everyone agrees here that the bad guy is CCP for keeping us from doing the job properly. Now if they stopped being arses we could start a something, for which someone will create a guideline of what Bloodlines should be, with WoD definitions and else and assigning meaningful tasks to those who are most well suited for it. Sadly, the WoD being what it is, it's hard for all of us to agree on what VTM should be, hence the diversity.

Cretino wrote:

Childe of Malkav wrote:

I don't know if it is really necessary to do something about this Terese trigger. But fixing it should be easy. Move the activator from logic_auto to the upper elevator doors, and set a disable sequence to the lower doors.

Which trigger at the Beachhouse are you talking about? (Sorry, I don't want to spend an hour watching someone else playing bloodlines. The time is better spent making a testrun for my own mod.)

It's very early in the run. Like, 10 minutes.
It's the trigger that breaks the ground on the staircase of th beach house. By jumping, you still reach the second floor, therefore skipping half of the house.

Topic closed?

Ah, you're talking about the Ocean House, not the beach house. Beach house is where you get the boom.
Yes, I know this trigger can be jumped. Did it myself on one or two occasions. But I don't think this needs repair. Players who do it only cheat themselves.

Childe of Malkav wrote:

Cretino wrote:

It's very early in the run. Like, 10 minutes.
It's the trigger that breaks the ground on the staircase of th beach house. By jumping, you still reach the second floor, therefore skipping half of the house.

Topic closed?

Ah, you're talking about the Ocean House, not the beach house. Beach house is where you get the boom.
Yes, I know this trigger can be jumped. Did it myself on one or two occasions. But I don't think this needs repair. Players who do it only cheat themselves.

Seen it a couple of times too.

It's zer0's fault! He eluded me into saying something else.
I don't even care if it's a house, a mansion or a sea!

Claudia wrote:

Bloodloss is a feature important to emulate pen and paper, but also to press the issue and the need to hunt and feed regularly. Anything using CE is using it, because CE started with Bloodloss. That was Zer0's mod to begin with, right?
Now it will be able to be non-running during dialog scenes (which was the main complain of it AFAIK).

Emulation of the p&p, right. So in the time that takes the Fledgling to go from his/her Haven to the Asylum, a day passes. Allow me to be skeptical. When you like something you can justify it with almost anything. And the same goes to me, when you dislike something no justification is sound enough.

I didn't like the firearms being OP either but as I said there's a thing for every taste, I just don't roll that way. For me Bloodlines does not need to be a difficult game. And even then, bloodloss and firearms being OP are more nuisances than real difficulty spikes (again, just in my opinion).

That being said, I liked very much the Assamite book dealer from TFN as I said, and the Nosferatu Clan specific quest from Clan Quest Mod, I can't speak from other clan quests since I only played as a Nossie.

What I like it's the most roleplaying aspects, new npcs that talk and clan specific things. What I don't like are the things that I perceive as annoying (bloodloss and too powerful guns). But that just me. I realize that it's almost impossible to love all the features of a product.
Even my beloved vanilla Bloodlines had the infamous Warrens level. Although I don't hate it so much as other people do.

To summarize, everyone got an opinion. And that's OK.